Which computer rack cases are you guys using???

[Donnie Frank]

Hey doods,

I'm thinking about rack mounting my computer. I like the idea of a thinner, 2 space computer case, but am not exactly sure how you guys manage to mount your RME cards in such a small beast.

What I'm looking for is what to look for in a case and what to stay away from. Like I said, I'd like to go with a 2U. Anyone had any luck with these thinner cases?

Thanx!

[Trackzilla]

1U and 2U cases will use riser cards to turn PCI/PCIe/AGP/whatever slots 90 degrees so they mount parallel to the MB...with 1U cases you get 1 slot available, with 2U you can get as many as 3...unless the MB and case are a combo designed for each other, pay attention to which way the riser you order leaves your slots oriented...the wrong way & you get to order another one ;)

[Cary B. Cornett]

There are some things that have been mentioned in other threads.

Any case shorter than 3U will have a non-standard sized power supply, meaning you can't just run to a computer store and buy a replacement in case of failure.

Unless you are using a fully shock-mounted rack, with a rackmount computer case all "jarring" forces in shipment are transmitted directly to the innards of the computer. Rackmount cases are fine for permanent installs, but for a road rig the computer needs to be isolated from shock in transit.

Rackmounting the computer does not save you all that much trouble in a road rig unless your keyboard, mouse, and display are fully integrated in the same rack. Otherwise, you still have to hook those up for every setup, and once you are doing that much it isn't that big a deal to keep the computer external to the rack. Also, if you still have to hook all that stuff up, it is easier to get at all the connectors if the computer is NOT in a rack. The computer may also stay a bit cooler that way, because of free airflow around most of the case.

So, either go with a bigger rackmount case, shock mounted, with full integration of everything into the rack, or just leave the computer outside the rack. Any "in between" solution will actually cause more trouble than it saves. Doing it right is neither small nor cheap, and trying to cheaply rackmount a computer will end up costing you more than you thought.

[Leadfoot]

I had my computer in a rack case, and I eventually put it back in the regular mid size tower case. For all the reasons Cary mentioned and the fact that the 4 space rack case alone (empty) weighed 35 lbs. I want all my stuff easily carry-able for one guy, and not bulky. As I keep saying, that to me is the beauty of a Sac system in the first place. Of course your needs may be different, but imo, I don't like the rack computer cases.

[Donnie Frank]

1U and 2U cases will use riser cards to turn PCI/PCIe/AGP/whatever slots 90 degrees so they mount parallel to the MB...with 1U cases you get 1 slot available, with 2U you can get as many as 3...unless the MB and case are a combo designed for each other, pay attention to which way the riser you order leaves your slots oriented...the wrong way & you get to order another one ;)

Ahhhh...."riser cards"...perfect. Thank you! And I will pay attention to the orientation. I'm looking at this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/2U-ATX-Rack-Mount-Rackmount-Computer-Server-Case-NEW-/170537897514?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27b4d9ce2a

See any reason why this one should or shouldn't work? My plan is to gut one of the dozen or so ATX computers I have laying around to build this one.

I already e'mailed the vendor requesting specific information concerning the riser card. The auction states that one is included, but doesn't state whether it's PCI or PCIe. I requested a PCI card, of course.

Since your case is 1U, I assume you run a single monitor? Or did you use a MB with on-board dual monitor capabilities?

Thanx for your help.

[chuckc]

One more thing to keep in mind. The smaller the case, the noisier it is. To keep your computer cool, it has to move much more air through the case, unless of course you let your case (and computer) get hot. I bought a couple of cases (3 rack units) for where I work and they sounded like jet engines. You have to look carefully for cases that moves the air but does so quietly.

just my two cents worth...

chuckc

[Donnie Frank]

There are some things that have been mentioned in other threads.

Any case shorter than 3U will have a non-standard sized power supply, meaning you can't just run to a computer store and buy a replacement in case of failure.



Good to know...though the 2U case I'm looking at on eBay does specifically say that a standard ATX power supply can be used. Here it is:

http://cgi.ebay.com/2U-ATX-Rack-Mount-Rackmount-Computer-Server-Case-NEW-/170537897514?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27b4d9ce2a




Unless you are using a fully shock-mounted rack, with a rackmount computer case all "jarring" forces in shipment are transmitted directly to the innards of the computer. Rackmount cases are fine for permanent installs, but for a road rig the computer needs to be isolated from shock in transit.



Yeah...I kind of figured. Right now the case I'm using *is* fully shock mounted:

http://drummerdonnie.com/sound/SAC/Pictures/SAC_Rack_Front_Sm_9-12-2010.jpg

As you can see I presently have a rack drawer installed in the bottom of the rack. Though convenient, this isn't really necessary. This is where the computer will be installed.




Rackmounting the computer does not save you all that much trouble in a road rig unless your keyboard, mouse, and display are fully integrated in the same rack. Otherwise, you still have to hook those up for every setup, and once you are doing that much it isn't that big a deal to keep the computer external to the rack.



Interesting...I was almost thinking the same thing. I normally use a Dell wireless mouse and keyboard. So I *could* keep the transmitter mounted inside the rack. And since I'm pretty dead-set on running dual monitors, I was thinking of keeping the DVI and VGA cables in the rack, too. Just pull 'em out and hook 'em up - same goes with the power cables.

The thing is, this darn 10U rack is too friggin' big for me to lift into my pickup truck. It's not too heavy, it's just too wide for me to get a good grip on the handles, and my 108 lb. girlfriend is no freakin' help. We're working on her upper body strength, but I digress...

I have a 10U rack that is NOT shock mounted. This is actually my analog outboard FX and E.Q. rack. I'm really on the fence with all this. Do I make the rig modular? Maybe 2, smaller racks? I have a bunch of 4U's laying around. Or is it better to keep it all in one, big box? I can always use a ramp to get the thing into my pickup. At this point I'm not out on tour or anything like that, so I'm thinking the isolation rack is a bit of an overkill. At this point I move my own gear - *carefully*. I only used the shock-mount case because I had it laying around anyway.

What would be perfect would be a 10U case that could be used as a stand-alone case *or* slid into an isolation case...the best of both worlds.




Also, if you still have to hook all that stuff up, it is easier to get at all the connectors if the computer is NOT in a rack. The computer may also stay a bit cooler that way, because of free airflow around most of the case.



And then there's that. I *have* been concerned about air flow for hotter, outdoor shows. The case I'm looking at has 3 fans....hmmmm....




So, either go with a bigger rackmount case, shock mounted, with full integration of everything into the rack, or just leave the computer outside the rack. Any "in between" solution will actually cause more trouble than it saves. Doing it right is neither small nor cheap, and trying to cheaply rackmount a computer will end up costing you more than you thought.

Thanx a ton, Cary. I was minutes away from the "Buy it now" button, but I think I'll hold off for now. I guess I'll shift gears for now and build a case for the tower. I've only got 2 SAC shows under my belt. The least thing I need is to spend a bunch of time and effort into building something that I'm just going to tear apart and redo.

Thanx for the advice.

[Yogi]

I bought this from newegg.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811108092

It's pretty darned small (and you need to be careful about how you assemble it to get everything in there) BUT... like I said it's small and lightweight. Cooling hasn't been a problem even with overclocking on the stock fan/heatsink.

Oh yeah, it takes full height cards...no riser.

[Donnie Frank]

I had my computer in a rack case, and I eventually put it back in the regular mid size tower case. For all the reasons Cary mentioned and the fact that the 4 space rack case alone (empty) weighed 35 lbs. I want all my stuff easily carry-able for one guy, and not bulky. As I keep saying, that to me is the beauty of a Sac system in the first place. Of course your needs may be different, but imo, I don't like the rack computer cases.

Thanx a ton for confirming what Cary stated. I'm going to hold off on the rack case for now. I'm going to shift gears towards smaller towers. I actually have one mini ATX computer laying around. I'm presently using it as a monitor stand...LOL...so I don't know how powerful the CPU is. This will probably become my remote computer. As of this writing I'm using 2, full-size towers for the host and remote. I can easily scale down the remote unit...maybe even a laptop...we'll see. For now I'm going to stay away from the computer rack cases. Thanx again.

[Donnie Frank]

One more thing to keep in mind. The smaller the case, the noisier it is. To keep your computer cool, it has to move much more air through the case, unless of course you let your case (and computer) get hot. I bought a couple of cases (3 rack units) for where I work and they sounded like jet engines. You have to look carefully for cases that moves the air but does so quietly.

just my two cents worth...

chuckc

At this point my work environments are inherently noisy. So fan noise isn't a big problem. But thanx for the heads-up!

[sjpaul]

I know some people will tear me up for this, but my SAC rig lives in an ABS plastic 10u case. I run an IBM SFF PC that is mounted within a 3u rack shelf, then above, I have 3 x ADA8K with a 1/3 unit space between each unit. Above those, lives a 1u headphone / wireless IEM transmitter, and above that is a 1u power distro. Finally, at the top is a 1u sliding rack shelf that houses the keyboard. The monitor is mounted into the rear lid and just lifts out and clips in to the top of the case at an angle for use. All cabling stays hooked up, so all it takes is to plug in the AC power and hook up the outputs to the amp rack. Job done...

It's just at the limit of the weight that I would want to carry any distance and I always make sure that it is ME who moves it....

[Doug_Danforth]

A while back someone posted a picture of their rack with two cases that latched together. I'd love to see that again. I don't recall if the bottom case contained amps or what, but the top case contained the ADAs and computer I think.

I want to configure our system like that. Put our three amps in the bottom rack, and the rest of the system in the top rack. That way they can all stay connected for 90% of the time (we have a trailer and a ramp) but I can disconnect the two racks if I need to put things in my SUV for transport. No more connecting ADAs to amps - just run six speaker cables.

I realize it will be heavy but we are slowly replacing our old heavy iron with new ultralight amps.

We also don't rack mount the PC - it just sits in a bed of foam secured with some braces. Monitor, keyboard, mouse and router stay permanently connected. It's a DIY rack and it's not real pretty, but it gets the job done.

Doug

[kylesoundman]

Good to know...though the 2U case I'm looking at on eBay does specifically say that a standard ATX power supply can be used. Here it is:

http://cgi.ebay.com/2U-ATX-Rack-Mount-Rackmount-Computer-Server-Case-NEW-/170537897514?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27b4d9ce2a



I have this exact case! It will take a standard power supply! However.....it will not work with PCIe cards with the particular riser I have that came with it and it only accepts 3 cards. If there are risers I am unaware of to solve this PCIe issue that would be great, otherwise integrated graphics are required if you fill up your PCI slots with RME cards like me:). Otherwise it seems well built. It requires a really deep rack as well, if being small and portable is of great importance that may be an issue. I will still probably build a computer in this case unless someone needs it!

Arrowmaxx has another case that is 4U but much shorter at 15" Deep, which I am going to use for my SAC rig. BTW Dont buy an Arrowmaxx case from Ebay the shipping is 15 bucks more than if you go to their website directly!

Here is the link to the case and their website! Its only 47bucks for the case!
http://www.arrowmax.com/storefront/product_info.php?cPath=34_28&products_id=268

When I pick up my 4U Arrowmaxx case I will give a review of it!

Hope this helps,

Kyle

[kylesoundman]

A while back someone posted a picture of their rack with two cases that latched together. I'd love to see that again. I don't recall if the bottom case contained amps or what, but the top case contained the ADAs and computer I think.

I want to configure our system like that. Put our three amps in the bottom rack, and the rest of the system in the top rack. That way they can all stay connected for 90% of the time (we have a trailer and a ramp) but I can disconnect the two racks if I need to put things in my SUV for transport. No more connecting ADAs to amps - just run six speaker cables.
Doug

This is a cool idea...if I were you I would multipin one rack to the next for signal etc...then keep a breakout cable in case you have to use your SAC rig with someone else's amp racks. I would also put XLR signal thru's out of your amp rack for adding more amps to a larger rig or something to that affect. I hope that all makes sense lol it does to me haha

Kyle

[kylesoundman]

I ordered this case today! And its ON SALE! 5 bucks off!

http://www.arrowmax.com/storefront/p...roducts_id=268

When I pick up my 4U Arrowmaxx case I will give a review of it!

Kyle

[Jazzyrick]

I know some people will tear me up for this, but my SAC rig lives in an ABS plastic 10u case. I run an IBM SFF PC that is mounted within a 3u rack shelf, then above, I have 3 x ADA8K with a 1/3 unit space between each unit. Above those, lives a 1u headphone / wireless IEM transmitter, and above that is a 1u power distro. Finally, at the top is a 1u sliding rack shelf that houses the keyboard. The monitor is mounted into the rear lid and just lifts out and clips in to the top of the case at an angle for use. All cabling stays hooked up, so all it takes is to plug in the AC power and hook up the outputs to the amp rack. Job done...

It's just at the limit of the weight that I would want to carry any distance and I always make sure that it is ME who moves it....

This sounds almost exactly like my rig. Although I do have it in a 12U Anvil style case, but I have the wireless router and wireless talkback mic mounted right to the top of my 4U computer case and 3 ADAs and a rackmounted keyboard/monitor/trackball. It was my second order though as the first unit was WAY too deep....like 30" or something. Be very aware of the depth of any keyboard/monitor rackmount unit you might be looking at. I have a fairly deep rack and I still had to fabricate some rear mounts for mine.

It's all worth not having to plug all that crap in every gig though.

[Wurst Werner]

The European SAC folks might check that out-->

http://yang-it.de/German/GHI-350.htm

[kylesoundman]

This sounds almost exactly like my rig. Although I do have it in a 12U Anvil style case, but I have the wireless router and wireless talkback mic mounted right to the top of my 4U computer case and 3 ADAs and a rackmounted keyboard/monitor/trackball. It was my second order though as the first unit was WAY too deep....like 30" or something. Be very aware of the depth of any keyboard/monitor rackmount unit you might be looking at. I have a fairly deep rack and I still had to fabricate some rear mounts for mine.

It's all worth not having to plug all that crap in every gig though.

I havent ironed out my dual monitor system yet....i own a cnc milling machine so im thinking I will design and build a dual monitor system that the monitors fold face to face then fold down then slide in on some sort of drawer system from the back side of the rack. Then a BCF2000, Keyboard, and mouse thats house under the top cover of the rack. I will build the entire rack myself so I can make it however i want or need.

And yes I am like you I refuse to waste time setting up something at a gig that could easily be in a rack and just opened up or folded out as needed.

As I get my system together I will start a thread that shows all the custom stuff I design etc..its going to be a fun project!

[kylesoundman]

The European SAC folks might check that out-->

http://yang-it.de/German/GHI-350.htm

Thats probably made better than the arrowmaxx...but the arrowmaxx is still only 15 inches deep in comparison. Im willing to sacrifice a little quality to save space in my rack.

[Bud Johnson]

You guys make me feel so lazy, cheap and trashy!:p
I bought a core-duo 2.13 ghz, 2 gb ram, HP desktop with an XP Pro sp3 coa off ebay for $200 shipped!
Took off the top, got my drill made holes on the side. I used small angle irons to attach it to a 3 space rack shelf. As I didn't have any riser cards (or apparently inclination to buy some:rolleyes:) I had to leave the top off as it was to short for my RME s. Also cut away small spaces on the back of the frame so the breakout cable could fit. As the RME daughter cards don't actually have to reside in a slot, they sit in a static bag resting on top of the memory on the mobo. Front had to come off as well. Ripped out the dvd-rom, added a 2nd sata drive also. Then I mounted into a 7 space SKB that I added/ mounted a small dolly to. I then put a power strip on the shelf next to the computer case.
Above the computer reside 2 ada8000 s and a presonus digimax fs.
It's absolutely the ugliest thing I've ever seen.:p
Works great, and very lite.
Obviously for more than 24 channels I need a second rack, but that keeps the individual racks weight way down.

The dolly I made with casters I had laying around. When I get around to it, I'll fit it with proper wheels. Then the 2nd SKB can be added to the top for rolling and separated for carrying. For now, the single SKB seems to be doing fine with casters.

I have been seen getting out of a cab with it and walking down the sidewalk carrying a gig bag and pulling the SKB behind me by a rope!:D

The guy at the hardware store calls me Jury, or Mr. Rig when being formal. ;)

[Donnie Frank]

You guys make me feel so lazy, cheap and trashy!:p

<snipola>

I have been seen getting out of a cab with it and walking down the sidewalk carrying a gig bag and pulling the SKB behind me by a rope!:D

The guy at the hardware store calls me Jury, or Mr. Rig when being formal. ;)

You, Sir, are my hero.

[Cary B. Cornett]

Bud, if others make you feel lazy and trashy, you make me feel snobbish and picky :eek:

I just had to read your rig description to my wife, who found it as amusing as I did. Funny thing is, my wife and I both pride ourselves on function being much more important than appearance, and in that regard, sir, you have just put us both to shame!

So... where do you keep the keyboard, display and such? In the gig bag, to be hooked up at the gig? For my road rig, I put that stuff (and by BCF2000) in a square suitcase affectionately dubbed "the hat box". The computer "rides loose", and the converter stuff is in an SKB rack. If I do PA, amps are carried in another small rack (my PA rig is too small for the average rock band, but about right for the occasional choir concert).

[Andreas]

What I use:
http://www.silverstonetek.com/products/p_contents.php?pno=gd01

[Bud Johnson]

So... where do you keep the keyboard, display and such? In the gig bag, to be hooked up at the gig? For my road rig, I put that stuff (and by BCF2000) in a square suitcase affectionately dubbed "the hat box".


If it's a smallish studio gig (VO, - trio) I can fit all I need (LCD and stand -usb keyboard-wireless mouse-mics etc. ) in a Tumi laptop bag. If I need more, my "hat box" is made by Samsonite.

If I need amps and such I'm forced to break out the 17 space shock mounted behemoth.


Andreas wrote:


What I use:
http://www.silverstonetek.com/produc...s.php?pno=gd01 (http://www.silverstonetek.com/products/p_contents.php?pno=gd01)
Very opulent! :D

[Trackzilla]

Since your case is 1U, I assume you run a single monitor? Or did you use a MB with on-board dual monitor capabilities?

Thanx for your help.

Actually, I'm working on unit #2 now...both are 1U cases, somewhere I've posted the stuff I did to mount an external fan on each case to keep them cool while not sounding like they were waiting for runway clearance from the tower :eek:

Both use onboard video which is a must for 1U implementation. Both use MOTU 424 cards, also a must if you are after 1U and want a respectable channel count. One MB is limited to one monitor, the other will do two (one VGA, the other DVI or HDMI)...The original lives in a behemoth rack with two 2408s, 6 ADAs, and 4U of UPS & external battery, a 23" monitor, kbrd & moose are mounted to the top of the rack with a lid that covers them...it weighs ALOT.

The second generation is aimed at smaller gigs & redundancy. An 8U case with a 1U KVM drawer, computer, 1 2408, 2 ADAs, and an Alto D4 power amp so the monitor amps for 4 mixes are included and prewired :)