BFC2000 vs MotorMix

[mr_es335]

Hello,

Any comments?

I know someone that is selling one in very good shape for under $100.00.

I presently use a BCF2000 and am satisfied with it...but for the price was wondering if I might be better off with the MotorMix? I do prefer USB over MIDI.

[Angie]

OK, here's my comparison. The Motormix has the digital read out and transport buttons and controls most of the functions on the SS channel strip. The BFC2000 only controls volume, pan, mute and solos using the BCF template. Others have gotten it to do more with some midi mapping. The Motormix is heavier and higher. But if you are aren't intending to travel with it, that isn't an issue. I found that the slap of the faders on the Behringer during automation playback was just too loud for the studio. The motors on the Motormix are much smoother, thus quieter. So, right now, my BFC is in storage, and two Motormixes (I may add a third at some point) are in use.

I should also add that I only have the Motormixes on during recording sessions when I'm using SAC as the virtual console for monitoring. It is not necessary for mixing and don't even have the template loaded into SAW.

[905shmick]

Hello,

Any comments?

I know someone that is selling one in very good shape for under $100.00.

I presently use a BCF2000 and am satisfied with it...but for the price was wondering if I might be better off with the MotorMix? I do prefer USB over MIDI.

Buy it and you can get rid of your BCF for what you paid for the Motormix.

[RBIngraham]

A hundred bucks for one is a great deal. Buy it. Much nicer, smoother faders and if you ever do any work with SAC, the LCD gives you channel names so you can see what fader you're really grabbing.

Working with MIDI is really no big deal and I'd take a Motormix any day over the BCF. Plus it's not a Behringer with all the BS that comes along with that, slipping belts, etc...

Plus my conscience felt a lot better once I got rid of all my Behringer crap. (although I do still have a pair of their DI boxes.. LOL)

[Carey Langille]

Whatever you do, DONT be an Audio Snob.... Behringer, Motomix... enjoy both for their Contribution to the music.. REMEMBER the music??? Guess my wish for the new year would be that all the Audio snobs see the light! Happy New Year....

[RBIngraham]

Whatever you do, DONT be an Audio Snob.... Behringer, Motomix... enjoy both for their Contribution to the music.. REMEMBER the music??? Guess my wish for the new year would be that all the Audio snobs see the light! Happy New Year....

Is that aimed at me? :confused:

And what "light" would that be?

The light that says all gear is just as good as other gear no matter how cheap or poorly manufactured it is?

Or is is the light that says don't pay any attention to the lack of ethics displayed by companies you buy things from?

Because to me and for my money, Behringer looses on both those counts, cheap products made by a company famous for outright coping of other companies projects.

Having said that, it's the ethics thing (or lack there of) that really annoys me the most and why I wouldn't buy any Behringer unless cost is the most important factor and I had no other choices. Same reason I try to never shop at WalMart and I avoid Apple products as much as possible.

[Ian Alexander]

One of the most valuable things I learned in college was that it is a good idea to assume that, no matter whom I meet, others' values are just as important to them as mine are to me. This means that my definition of "the light" might be very different from someone else's and that's okay. A little mutual respect and rational discussion often shows me that our differences are fewer than our similarities.

Another way to put it: Do you want to look like a Congressman? :)

[RBIngraham]

One of the most valuable things I learned in college was that it is a good idea to assume that, no matter whom I meet, others' values are just as important to them as mine are to me. This means that my definition of "the light" might be very different from someone else's and that's okay. A little mutual respect and rational discussion often shows me that our differences are fewer than our similarities.

Another way to put it: Do you want to look like a Congressman? :)

Good point, but not sure what Congress has to do with it. In poll after poll, Congress as a whole gets very poor approval ratings as we all know. However when asked if they approve of their personal congress person, that rating goes way up for many of them.

Of course I wouldn't want to "look" like any of the members of congress that have represented me. Several of them have been the opposite gender of me for one thing. :D

[Carey Langille]

[quote=RBIngraham;174963]Is that aimed at me? :confused:

And what "light" would that be?


The LIGHT is THE MUSIC.. Im an Audio Engineer, i can pretty much use any tools and get a pleasing final product... I dont really care what the label says, Guess thats why i use SawStudio too.....

[RBIngraham]

The LIGHT is THE MUSIC.. Im an Audio Engineer, i can pretty much use any tools and get a pleasing final product... I dont really care what the label says, Guess thats why i use SawStudio too.....

Totally agree with the notion that a good engineer will get decent results with any gear. But that only goes so far really. Lets be realistic, SAW is not exactly the cheapest DAW out there now is it?

Just for the sake of debate, do you think you would get the same results with just any old audio recording and editing application? I suspect you could get really close if not identical results. However you can do it a lot faster and enjoy your labor much more with tools you like correct?

Yeah you can use all the cheapest gear and get decent results, but you can also save a lot of hassle and just use nicer gear in the first place and save a lot of "polishing" as well.

If having a conscience about whom I buy things from or wanting to get things done easier makes me a snob, well then I'm a proud snob. :)

Although I wish I had the wallet to be a real audio snob. ;)

[Ian Alexander]

Good point, but not sure what Congress has to do with it.

Just that representatives from opposing parties seem unable to find any middle ground or agree on anything. And that they express their disagreement in particularly nasty ways that seem designed to prevent any future agreement. :)

[Dave Labrecque]

One of the most valuable things I learned in college was that it is a good idea to assume that, no matter whom I meet, others' values are just as important to them as mine are to me. This means that my definition of "the light" might be very different from someone else's and that's okay. A little mutual respect and rational discussion often shows me that our differences are fewer than our similarities.

Another way to put it: Do you want to look like a Congressman? :)

LOL. Well said, Ian. :)

[Soundguy]

The LIGHT is THE MUSIC.. Im an Audio Engineer, i can pretty much use any tools and get a pleasing final product... I dont really care what the label says, Guess thats why i use SawStudio too.....

But at the time you make a purchase, you are also a consumer, and must use rational engineering experience or opinions of your peers to justify your purchase. Music only comes into play after you plug it in.

Soundguy

[Carey Langille]

But at the time you make a purchase, you are also a consumer, and must use rational engineering experience or opinions of your peers to justify your purchase. Music only comes into play after you plug it in.

Soundguy

Exactly, and lots of the inexpensive tools out there from MANY different companies including behringer work perfectly fine..... Ethics, people have been stealing amp circuits, guitar designs, device working theories for EVER......there are no slave kids tied to rocks making behringer products, no one whips people to put them together. The are made in LARGE factories by hard working people like BILLIONS of other products... If anyone cares to look back MANY years in the forum, I was the First test user of the ADA8000 and reported my findings to this forum and bob... I still have the first 3 original ada8000 in my rack and they work perfectly fine, yes i have had a failure o few yrs back, but my lexicon went down a fe yrs back too....they all die eventually and need fixing... If it sounds good, use it, if it sucks, throw it out of mod it....
dont worry about the name....
Gear bashing or name bashing gets us no where...
make music
enjoy life
Happy New Year

[RBIngraham]

Well the original post was asking for a comparison and anyone in their right mind that have used both a BCF2000 and a Motormix would certainly take a Motormix. Unless maybe you are using SAC and you want 32 faders, since the BCF templates allow for 4 units and the Motormix templates top out at 3 units. At least I can not image why anyone would prefer the BCF over the Motormix. The only case I can think where I would go with the BCF is for places that are not able to or won't buy used gear. The only advantage I can think of with the BCF is that it can be programmed as to what messages it sends out, so it is possible to be a bit more universal.

Well at least that is my snobbish opinion based on use of both products. :rolleyes:

[RBIngraham]

PS. Carey, the link in your signature pops up with a this domain is for sale window? Is it just me that gets this?

[Soundguy]

If anyone cares to look back MANY years in the forum, I was the First test user of the ADA8000 and reported my findings to this forum and bob... I still have the first 3 original ada8000 in my rack and they work perfectly fine, yes i have had a failure o few yrs back, but my lexicon went down a fe yrs back too....

You are overlooking the fact that the ADA8000 has a exorbitantly high failure rate that is well documented here and on audio forums everywhere. The reputation of the control surface is not so great either. So if reliability is important to a user, then Behringer may be a poor choice, even though you may consider your failure rate acceptable.

Offering equipment suggestions based on experience is hardly "bashing".

Soundguy

[Leadfoot]

You are overlooking the fact that the ADA8000 has a exorbitantly high failure rate that is well documented here and on audio forums everywhere. The reputation of the control surface is not so great either. So if reliability is important to a user, then Behringer may be a poor choice, even though you may consider your failure rate acceptable.

Offering equipment suggestions based on experience is hardly "bashing".

Soundguy

First my apology for going even further off topic..

Well my experience offering is this.. I've had three of them(ada8000) since they came out, never had any problems whatsoever, been through periods of heavy use and abuse, and still going strong. Also I directly A/B'd them side by side with my Focusrite Octopre MK2 dynamics and I was really expecting to hear some dramatic difference.. I couldn't hear any difference. So for the record, I've definitely got my moneys worth. Most Behringer stuff I've seen/heard is garbage, but for some reason, these ADA's have been darn good to me. I've gotta use 'em again tonight so I should probably not jinx it anymore than I already have :)

Happy New Year!

Tony

[bcorkery]

PS. Carey, the link in your signature pops up with a this domain is for sale window? Is it just me that gets this?I'm getting the same thing.
:confused:

[905shmick]

Looks like it might not have been renewed and someone is now squatting on it.

The update timestamp of December 16 2011 would mean it's something recently done.


Domain Name: OCEANSOUNDPRODUCTIONS.COM
Registrar: KEY-SYSTEMS GMBH
Whois Server: whois.rrpproxy.net
Referral URL: http://www.key-systems.net
Name Server: NS1.SEDOPARKING.COM
Name Server: NS2.SEDOPARKING.COM
Status: ok
Updated Date: 16-dec-2011

[JLepore]

Back to the original post....

I have used both, and now own 2 motormixes.

The Behringers are NOISY, less precisise in both fader resolution and it's ability to stay in alignment, they require "belt tightening", sometimes right out of the box. They are cheaply built plastic devices. When something goes wrong, they are not worth fixing, if there is anyone that would fix them.

The Motormix is a sturdy constructed unit made of metal. It has smooth faders, with better resolution. The faders stay in aligment, and don't slam into the endstops, and can be used in a quiet room. They have scribble strips so you are sure of where you are. They have access to significantly more functions. The designers email address is public, and if contacted will fix/upgrade/or anything else just for the asking. Sending a unit to him with his modest fee gives you a unit restored to brand-new condition.

There is no serious comparison in my opinion. When you factor in your ability to find one at that price, it's a no brainer.

[karagjoz]

Be aware of problems with the motors of the channels if U buy a used unit {I mean Motormix}. I had a trouble with a channel of a Motormix.
Many times the motor of the channel is working, but not very precisely. In this case when the unit is sending midi messages to the software and vice versa, the position of the fader is not responding to the position of the software. This is a mistake for the unit and the coresponding fader "sticks" in one position. This can be very frustrating. Simple reassembling and cleaning of the faders doesn't help.

[RBIngraham]

Be aware of problems with the motors of the channels if U buy a used unit {I mean Motormix}. I had a trouble with a channel of a Motormix.
Many times the motor of the channel is working, but not very precisely. In this case when the unit is sending midi messages to the software and vice versa, the position of the fader is not responding to the position of the software. This is a mistake for the unit and the corresponding fader "sticks" in one position. This can be very frustrating. Simple reassembling and cleaning of the faders doesn't help.

That sounds like you have one of the original ROM chip installed. If you boot it up and it says something like ROM 1.10, then you'll run into these issues every once in while. All of my units have that ROM and they all do that. One of my Motormixes is essentially brand new as I had it rebuilt already after it had a disaster in the back of a van and the LCD was busted. Unfortunately that was before I was using SAC and so I didn't have Carl put in a new ROM chip.


Some day I just need to send all of mine out to Carl and get them updated. Just need a combination of both time and the funds at the same time. :)

[karagjoz]

This is very interesting... Can these units flash themselves via MIDI or it is possible only by hardware change of the chip? I throw out my motormix somewhere, but I can use it again if software update is possible.

[Angie]

This is very interesting... Can these units flash themselves via MIDI or it is possible only by hardware change of the chip? I throw out my motormix somewhere, but I can use it again if software update is possible.

You have to get the chip direct from Carl Malone. It is affordable and a very easy replacement. Carl gives very good instructions on disassembly. You can contact him via email cmfluteguy at earthlink.net

[mr_es335]

Hello,

Thanks to all that responded. Very much appreciated.

I did pick up the unit and it has ROM 1.08.

My only complaint thus far is that it does not have the IRO functionality that the BCF-2000 has.

[JLepore]

Bob just fixed the template to properly supply the I/O/R functions on a single motormix. check the post on the SAC side of the forum from today.

The updated ROMS were $50 per unit when I got them earlier this year. Simple to do-it-yourself installation.