Monitor Audio Signals over Ethernet!!

[Jehun koa]

I am reading SAC manual with awesome functions & huge possibility of real mixing area!!!
Thank you Bob so much!!!!!
SAC is what I had been searching so long time ago.

And I have one Idea for monitor signal distribution just one minute ago.

That Is stage Monitor Signals over ethernet !!
If SAC can send monitor mix audio signal to remote SAC with control data,
it will be great thing to wired IEM or Heaphone monitoring situations like Drummer and etc.

Just in my opinion, ethersound can send 64ch audio signals over only 10/100 network linking environment.
So, If SAC can send 4ch monitor audio signals (2 for monitor, 2 for monitor solo bus), it will be great point.
Audio snake or cable for headphone amp input will no more needed.

If consider that todays most computer's audio chipset performenc is so good then ever,
and if asio4all asio driver for general computer's audio chipset operation properly,
SAC users CAN use his notebook or computer not only for remote but also headphone amp without any other connection execpt only LAN cable.


How about this??? :D

[Andy Hamm]

In my main mixrack, I just have a 4 channel headphone amp and I have a bunch of 25 meter headphone extensions. This gives me 4 seperate wired IEMS for about $200.

I've yet to find an act that would use 4 wired IEMs though, I might use one or two and I end up leaving one for myself in case I want to walk up to the stage and listen to something through headphones, which never really happens all that often either.

[Butch Bos]

Audio over network not good BUT
if you are using 10/100 you have 2 spare pairs in the cable which can be used for headphone feed

Butch

[dasbin]

Theoretically, it seems to me that you could just install the Dante "Virtual Soundcard" drivers on both ends (remote and host), and you're done. Exactly what you wanted. ASIO interface over the network.

This isn't anything that SAC should or shouldn't support. You're just talking about a third-party ASIO-to-IP driver and format, like Dante.

[RBIngraham]

Theoretically, it seems to me that you could just install the Dante "Virtual Soundcard" drivers on both ends (remote and host), and you're done. Exactly what you wanted. ASIO interface over the network.

This isn't anything that SAC should or shouldn't support. You're just talking about a third-party ASIO-to-IP driver and format, like Dante.

That would be extremely tricky to make work unless you're also using Dante to get the audio I/O in and out of your SAC host.

SAC can only talk to one ASIO device at a time. So if you have an RME card you use for the SAC host for example you can not have SAC also talk to Dante at the same time.

You would have to do something like bring a headphone feed into another sound card on the computer that could then make some kind of connection to the virtual Dante sound card and then do the opposite at the SAC Remote end somehow getting the signal from the Dante virtual sound card out a headphone output or something.

A real kludge in my opinion. Might be better if you were actually using Dante as the sound card I/O to the SAC host. Then it would at least solve the issue in getting the Solo output from SAC onto the Dante network. But you would still have to play some tricks on the SAC remote computer to get the audio off the Dante network and out to a headphone jack.

Just save the pennies, buy a RF In Ear System from Sennheiser or Shure and be done with it. Simple to set up, easy to use, much less convoluted.

[roffez]

Audio over network not good BUT
if you are using 10/100 you have 2 spare pairs in the cable which can be used for headphone feed

Butch
If you have your monitor signals available as ADAT or SPDIF, you can run them with the Appsys ADX-8 extender over these spare wires. No latency issues etc, but the drawback is that you need an Cat5 cable splitter (read: wire adapter) on each end to inject/extract the signals.

[Yogi]

We have the ADAT extender and we run 8 stereo channels of wired in ear from FOH back to the stage. At the stage end we have 2 4 channel headphone amps, one on each side of the stage. Everyone loves it. Only occasionally are minor adjustments necessary. Before, working with 4 monitors was like herding cats, no one was happy. It was somewhat hard to get them to try the in ears at first but now they wouldn't use anything else. As an aside the Appsys extender uses all 8 lines per Cat-5 connection, one pair for each 8 channels of ADAT.

[vasco_nl]

Theoretically, it seems to me that you could just install the Dante "Virtual Soundcard" drivers on both ends (remote and host), and you're done.Theoretically, nice thoughts but sorry that's not going to work. Read the manual from Dante please. You need at least one peace of Dante hardware in the network to run. Only two computer's with the Dante virtual Audio driver will not work.

[roffez]

As an aside the Appsys extender uses all 8 lines per Cat-5 connection, one pair for each 8 channels of ADAT.
That's true for the large 19" ADX-32 and ADX-64 units. The $99 ADX-8 (one ADAT only) uses 4 lines (two for ADAT and two to power the receiver).

[RBIngraham]

Theoretically, nice thoughts but sorry that's not going to work. Read the manual from Dante please. You need at least one peace of Dante hardware in the network to run. Only two computer's with the Dante virtual Audio driver will not work.


Figures!

Thanks for the information.

[vasco_nl]

You're welcome.

If you wanna use Dante, take the Dante computer card (add own DSP's like RME etc.) and something like Focusrite RedNet as snake.

I also took a look at Dante in my search around the audio I/O for SAC untill I found the prices ;)

[vasco_nl]

That's true for the large 19" ADX-32 and ADX-64 units. The $99 ADX-8 (one ADAT only) uses 4 lines (two for ADAT and two to power the receiver).You can also power both sides separated of the ADX-8 and than this unit only need one pair for 8 channels of audio. You need one extra power supply for this and add the wires directly to the UTP connector add the receiver side.

[Yogi]

I'm not sure I'd want to add audio into an UTP cable carrying digital data. Crosstalk could screw up the digital data and vice versa. The U in UTP stands for unshielded.

[jlklein]

I'm not sure I'd want to add audio into an UTP cable carrying digital data. Crosstalk could screw up the digital data and vice versa. The U in UTP stands for unshielded.

Which is why I never understood why Avioms specifically prohibit STP cable...and it actually does screw up their operation. Only UTP for Avioms. No issues with it, but still weird.

Jeff

[Yogi]

UTP is used when the transmitters and receivers are differential offset type. STP is primarily for a differential that is considered + in one line and - on the other line (think XLR which can be single signal driven with the negative pole referenced to ground). A differential offset depends on one line being the exact opposite of the other line and anything that is not is rejected. It's the only way to get 350 mhz square waves through a line at distances greater than 100 feet. Wiring capacitance plays a big part in there too as does resistance and impedance coupling. The Avioms are all digital.

[Butch Bos]

Line level audio and data are about the same voltages or at least close enough that crosstalk is not a problem

Butch

[JLepore]

cross talk should be seen as induced noise and equal and opposite in the adjacent pairs. That is the whole purpose behind the twisted pair in the first place.

[roffez]

I'm not sure I'd want to add audio into an UTP cable carrying digital data. Crosstalk could screw up the digital data and vice versa. The U in UTP stands for unshielded.
I would also not recommend transmitting analog audio due to the issues mentioned. However, the proposed ADX-8 solution transmits data digitally and works perfectly together with ethernet (crosstalk is not an issue here).