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View Full Version : Comparing program features for ideas



Kahalab
03-29-2005, 12:33 AM
SAWStudio is a great program, in many ways the best out there, but who says you can get some new ideas from other programs?

So, i've been checking out other programs. My brother in-law has Ntracks, and Power Tracks Pro. A friend has Adobe Audition (which was Cool Edit Pro). I've got Sonar.

Let's start with effects and plugs [oh no! :eek:]

Each of these programs have plug-in lists with bypass buttons by each plug name for easy monitoring and comparisons.

To give you an idea of why this is cool, let's pretend we change a very useful feature in SAWStudio. In W Mixer there are individual bypass buttons for EQ, Compression, and Gate. Now imagine that instead of those bypass button you have to click on the name Compression, EQ, Gate to open a large window for each one and then click on a bypass button in that window. Then if you no longer want the window in your way you have to close each one. Anyone want to take away the EQ, Compression, and Gate bypass buttons from the W Mixer and use this method instead? Having similar bypass buttons next to the plug names in the Post and Pre windows would make life a bit easier.

Adobe Audition has an ingenious way of viewing the interfaces for the various active effects - using a tab system. To get to each effect all you need to do is click on the respective tab and the effect interface instantly appears. In this way all the interfaces remain neatly tucked away in a limited space - a single self-adjusting window. Ultra efficient use of space, and much much easier to work with than having a mess of plug interface windows clutter your workspace.

The last tab in this window brings up another cool cool feature - an effects mixer with faders for FX levels, as well as buttons for allowing the FX to work in parallel or serial configurations. It's here that you also have the bypass buttons for each effect - right above the fader.

Adobe Audition also has a wonderful method to load up plugs and effects with. Just double click on the one you want and it loads them up! It took me less than 30 seconds to load 30 effects. ;)

Sonar has a fantastic way to save and load (in real time) the settings you create in a plug. No need to click open anything on the interface - It's right in front of you! There before you eyes is the name of the current setting in a box. Click on the arrow by the box and a drop down list appears allowing you to change to whatever preset you want. If you want to save a new setting all you have to do is type the name in the box and press the save icon. Save as many as want, load as many as you want, in real time, while you are previewing. It very very very simple and very very very efficient. (So efficient that if someone had told me about it i would have guessed that it was a feature in normally super efficient SAW Studio rather than not very efficient Sonar).

And in Sonar if you want to move a plug from one position in the chain to another you just drag it to where ever you want it to go. Very easy, very fast.

SAWStudio is in the lead for use and efficiency in many many ways compared with these 4 programs. Unfortunately, when it comes to the entire combination of adding, bypassing, loading/saving, and previewing plugs it doesn't fare very well.

So Bob, i'd like to ask you to please make a great program even better and see if you can't add these features (or some variation of your own) to SAWStudio

Thank you! :)

Bob L
03-29-2005, 01:15 AM
Can you double-click and choose to add the plugin pre or pst of the fader on each track and even both places at the same time? If so, how does the double-click know which place to patch? Can you also choose aux sends pre or pst of the Fx in either of the pre or pst patch points and differently for each aux... I doubt it... we are talking about Fx versatility way beyond even the most expensive systems in the world.

It looks like you are comparing things that are quite different... SAWStudio offers many different powers with the use of plugins... therefore the patching methods are different... and they are designed the way I liked them designed.

And do you realize how many people love the ability to line up their plugins on a second monitor and keep the windows separate... as opposed to having everything forced into a single window with tabs...

Each person has different likes and dislikes... just like you feel the need to patch 20 and 30 plugs at the same time to decide which one to use... many of us can make that decision almost intuitivley with one or two experiments and we may like the fact that we are not limited to all plugs in a single window. Allow us the freedom to not be made wrong for the way we might like to work.

If you love the way these other programs work with plugins... and plugins are your main focus... then perhaps one of these other programs would be better suited for your needs.

I for one, dislike almost everything about each of the programs you mentioned, and took it upon myself to create something that works quite differently... as the creator... I am extremely happy with the way it works... and it satisfies my needs drastically better than the other programs...

At least allow me that freedom of choice in design...

Please... can we move on from this overblown and absolutely boring discussion of how lame SAWStudio's handling of plugins is... I and perhaps many others here would probably be grateful.

What you believe is what you believe... we have all heard your comments... and now its time to move on.... please...

Disabling plugins in the listbox has been on the todo list from the beginning... when it finally makes it to the top of the list, you may see it implemented in some fashion... but I hardly doubt it will look like Sonar.

It just has not even been a consideration over and above many other absolutely unique and powerful options that have taken precendence and have made SAWStudio quite a blessing for many when it comes to how a DAW is designed and performs.

End of discussion.... Please! :)

Bob L

Kahalab
03-29-2005, 01:37 AM
Both at the same time - probably not. But otherwise it's just a matter of pre-hilighting the position in pre/post and then going to the plugs list and double click like a madman ;)

Otherwise, i agree, tiime to let this rest. I've said what i wanted, and you have given me some very long responses. You may have found it boring, but i think it's been an intersting discussion - if for no other reason than to hear a bit about how different people use this part of the interface.

As for SawStudio, it would be pretty surprising if you didn't think it was completely fantastic. It's your program, and in many ways you've designed it for the way you work.

At the same time you have been responsive to the desires of many users - who have come with tons of suggestions over the years - and thrown in features that would otherwise not be there. This has also made SAWStudio a much stronger program than if you had been sitting in isolation working on it for the last 12 or more years.

I may not always agree with you on aspects of SAWStudio, but i think it's a great program with a lot of impressive programming. Thanks! :)

And i think it is cool that users of SAW can interact with you and with each other here on the forum :) :)

Bob L
03-29-2005, 03:19 AM
Thanks,

Many of the great ideas for options have come from these discussions, or direct email or phone interaction with the users... and will continue to do so.

Each one is noted in my todo list and is approached when the time comes. If I can work the suggestion into the code without any serious side effects, I usually will do so. In many cases the option is enhanced beyond the discussion... in other cases, it is included in a more limited fashion... sometimes, the option is thrown out, for one reason or another.

I'm all for improving the program as time and technology permits. :)

Bob L

NEVADA
03-29-2005, 04:03 AM
Hi guys,
Please forgive me while I put my 2 pence in. I have read scanned this thread and been keeping a very keen eye on this forum as a whole. I have run & tested the demo version of SAWstudio & the only thing that had me holding my horses on buying was until yesterday I thought there was no way of generating a midi clock signal from SAW without buying an external box but it seems that Jon Marshall Smith was WAAAAYYY ahead of me. THANQ MR SMITH :)
I am currently using Cubase SX, with Reason synced via midiclock. I have used Pro Tools, Logic, Adobe Audio (CEP) etc & having worked in quite a few of the "BIG" :rolleyes: Studios in London on SSL, Neve, Amek etc back in the day, I find threads like this one intriguing. :confused:
My Assumption is that EVERYONE users & non users alike have one thing in common & that is a love of music (whatever the genre). And many would have done anything (within reason) to get use one of those or similar studios in the past to say that they had used an SSL, NEVE etc & many did pay excruciatingly high prices.
This issue of plug ins is a no brainer if you go back to the days when if you had one fx unit then you had one fx unit PERIOD etc. Patch cables & patch bays ended up looking like dropped spaghetti and you had to remember every move you did on a mix before FLYING FADERS :cool:
SAWstudio does what none of these other programs does it brings "BIG" studio power to you and me in a way that anyone who had never used a "BIG" studio used SAWstudio and then they went to a "BIG" studio they would understand those "BIG" desks due to the superb layout of the SS channel strip.
I for one look at SAWstudio and remember the time spent doing what are now simple mouse clicks.
There are TOOOOOOOOO MAAANNNYYY advantages to SAWstudio to list down for my little 2 pence
I do not compare SAW to the other DAW's out there I actually compare it to the "BIG" desks. I don't think there is a truly comparable DAW out there (IMO)
(Check the forums for the other DAW's then come back here... there are some very unhappy people out there who have bought into the marketing & industry standard hype)
I for one will be joining the ranks of SAW users this April. :D
Thanks Bob you are a genius & I for one hope this program becomes as popular as FORD.
Arise Sir Bob, Knight of the Mixing Table(Desk) :)

Here's to everyone recording & creating great music PEACE

P.S I just noticed that the automation move colours on the multitrack match the corresponding modules on the channel strip on the desk.. :cool: WHAT CAN I SAY MY 2 PENCE IS ALL USED UP :)