adding effects to incoming signals

[loosejaw]

Hi all, just wanted to know how i could add a little effects return reverb to a vocal track when recording...basically so that when the singer is recording his track he can have a little reverb in the cans...is this possible.

thanx

Jilly

[Bob L]

Sure thing... but I would recommend you record dry and only include the verb in the monitor path.

This all depends on what the singer is listening to... SAWStudio aux send signals... SAWStudio main signal (same as engineer)... or some direct monitor signal from an external mixer... or TotalMix with an RME card... etc.

If you use SAWStudio itself in low latency (ASIO generally) mode, then you have complete freedom to setup an aux send/return for reverb and also pass that thru to the performer's mix (aux send also presumably).

The whole monitoring thing can be handled in many diofferent ways... each one has its pluses and minuses and complexities.

What would be your prefferred method from the list above?

Bob L

[loosejaw]

thanks for your time...i would like to record dry trax, and monitoring will be thru the saw studio mains.

[Bob L]

Ok... then I presume you can acheive low latency... buffers set at 3 x 128 or lower... generally 3 x 64 is a good setting.

Then, you can turn ON one of the Tape-Style audio monitor protocols in the Options menu.

Now... when you arm a track for recording and select a device input in the record meter, the record signal will be passed thru the SAWStudio virtual console chan... and you can hear it directly thru the main SAWStudio outputs... generally Out Chan 1.

You can control the fader level... the eq, compression and so forth on the console chan strip... all that you adjust there is what you will hear... the record signal will stay dry... allowing you to later eq, compress and make mixing decisions during the editing and mixing phase of the project.

If you send some level to aux send 1 on the virtual console chan of the vocal, and have your verb patched in on the Return 1 chan (chan also assigned to the main out bus), then you will hear the reverb in your monitor mix.

Now you have a choice to send a copy of the monitor mix to the performer thru a headphone out tapped off of what you are hearing... you both hear the same mix... meaning the performer will also hear the verb you are hearing... you will be forced to adjust your mix to satisfy the performer.

Or... you can now also choose to use another aux send for the performer mix and send the signal directly out of the aux send master on the proper send chan... assign the send master out to a different out device than the one you are listening to... feed this to a small headphone amp and adjust a separate mix in the aux sends for each track of music... in this way, you can send a different mix to the performer (or multiple performers using different aux sends). This is very much the way a pro recording studio setup works with a physical console and 24 track tape deck.

In order to hear the reverb in this same aux mix, you have two ways to go. If you send the aux master signal direct to a device out, then you can use the same Output chan (assigned to itself as a hardware out) and blend the reverb signal directly into the aux master mix going to the headphones... you just have to assign the main reverb return chan also to this same bus out... so it will assign to bus 1 (what you hear) and bus x (what the performer hears).

You can also choose to return the performer aux mix down to its own return chan as a virtual connection and assign that to an out chan assigned to itself. This will send the aux mix itself to the phones and if you also assign the verb return to the same bus out, it will mix in the verb return signal... with this method you do not have separate control of the wet verb return level in the phones and in the control room... the other method does give separate wet return by using the out chan you assigned for the verb only.

All of this keeps the recording dry and flat, while you are free to monitor whatever you want to hear.

Bob L

[loosejaw]

Geez Bob that is so aweome, thanx again for your time...works great....one more question, lets say i want the effect on the channel to actually print to the track in realtime , compression, eq , whatever, then what must i do?

[Bob L]

I don't recommend it... because you have more opportunity to adjust it later when tweaking the mix if you record a flat signal... and you gain nothing in the way of signal to noise or clipping headroom... but, you can force the record signal for any track thru the console chan and all of its processing and patched effects by changing the input source assignment at the top of the channel strip to point directly to the input device and then point the record meter input source to the mixer chan itself... in this manner, the record signal is tapped from just after the pre-patch point on the chan strip... which by default will include the eq and dynamics and pre patch fx processing.

You can also force the pre-patch point or the record tap in front of the eq and dynamics section with options on the Mixer menu.

When assigning input sources this way, use the mono menu (left-click next to the mono button) and select L-Only or R-Only for mono signals.

Bob L

[Cary B. Cornett]

...one more question, lets say i want the effect on the channel to actually print to the track in realtime , compression, eq , whatever, then what must i do? The total mix recall that is a natural part of how SAW works eliminates any need to "print" eq, compression or any other effect to the sound file. First of all, there is NO difference between the sound "as printed" and the sound processing a dry track. Whether applied before or after recording, it is the same. These two factors mean that there is no advantage to "printing" compression, EQ, etc.
There is, however, a great disadvantage to processing "to tape": once a process is applied, it is almost impossible to "remove". It is therefore wise to keep your processing all in the mix/monitor part of the chain so that you can later change or eliminate it in any way that you desire.

At one time there were reasons for printing processes to tape, but all of those reasons go away with the combination of digital recording and using a DAW to mix. When I worked with analog tape and consoles, I would often "print" EQ and compression while tracking. It took me a while to unlearn those habits when I moved to computer-based recording, but now I NEVER "print" any process during tracking. I simply have no need to do so.

[loosejaw]

thats so great, thanks for all your help, i have one more question....can you putreverbs and 3rd party plugins on the input before hitting tape so that its is recorded with reverb or another effect on if.

[loosejaw]

i just figured it out, you can use vst effects printed to the tracks, that is so freakin cool...i now that you dont have to, or it may not be a good idea, but i still think its awesome, wow.
Can you integrate hardware like comps , eq's and fx into a live mix thru a routing technique?

[Bob L]

Yes you can... using the aux send/returns... there is a special latency compensation built into the engine when it sees an aux send to a device and the corresponding return underneath it set to an input device... so you can then send to a hardware verb, and return from that hardware verb into the mix... in sync.

Realize that when you do this, you disable the faster-than-realtime build-mix options since the mix must now be done in realtime like a physical console and tape deck.

Bob L

[loosejaw]

Just one more question, can u print effect sends to tape via the effects return, i haven't been able to do that yet

[Bob L]

Not directly... you can send the aux masters to a device out and then cable that back into another record input.

You can do the same thing with the returns by assigning the return to an output chan assigned to itself as the hardware output and then cable that back into another record input.

All in all... you can do just about anything crazy like this in one way or another... but I now must ask... why???

Stop overthinking and get back to recording and then do what you need to do in the mix.

Bob L

[loosejaw]

again thankyou for your time....i just really wanted to know the full power of this software, i know that most people wouldn't try this stuff, but i like trying and doing things that don't make perfect sense all in the name of inspiration sometimes, if that makes sense.

thanks again, wonderful software, just brilliant

cheers

Jilly