SAW/SAC on MacBook - Is FireWire available to Windows?

[AlanH]

Hi Folks,

I'm looking to create a notebook-based recording rig using my FireWire-based interface (MOTU 8pre + ADA8000 expansion). My existing notebook PC is too slow and glitchy to use on critical sessions with confidence.

I have a RayDAT-based shuttle PC setup, which is great, but with separate monitor, keyboard and UPS, it's messy for small recording jobs.

Very few notebook PCs have a built-in FireWire port these days, and those that do always use the weedy 4-pin socket. And not many notebooks have an ExpressCard port for a FireWire adaptor.

So, much against my principles, I was wondering if a MacBook with BootCamp & Win XP might provide a workable solution. (It would solve some app/file compatibility problems with arty-type friends at the same time.)

I'd like to know, from anyone who has gone there, whether the MacBook's FireWire port is available to Windows in a form suitable for SAW / SAC, i.e. such that it works stably with MOTU drivers at low(-ish) latency.

This is just a technical question - I don't want to trigger a "Mac vs. PC - which is better" discussion here

Cheers,

[Bob L]

I have heard from many users with success on a Mac laptop and bootcamp... if you can stay with Win XP... I would.

Bob L

[richswit]

I can tell you it will see the firewire port, but I have had no luck using any firewire interface with SAW, even on a Dell computer. I am running windows 7 on the Mac and Dell. I don't care, cuz I use a USB interface instead.
Even tried my new Presonus 16.0.2 firewire mixer. No go. When I hit the spacebar for play, it rolls, but no sound, then the sound comes in but I don't hear what I'm seeing. (playback is late with the cursor) Hit the space bar again to stop, and it plays a little longer, then a message comes up "forcing engine shut down" and it stops.
USB, no problemo.

[RBIngraham]

Firewire can be a pit picky... but then I find all the various sound card options to be finicky at best... I have had issues with PCI, PCIe, Firewire, USB... you name it... there could be an issue. Sound Cards and their drivers are basically a crap shoot. Some manufacturers fare better than others... but I've had issues with just about every manufacturer out there, RME, Echo, MOTU, M-Audio, etc, etc, etc... they all have some great products... and some clinkers!

Anyway, the Mac running under bootcamp should work for you. It worked fine under my Mac Mini, but my Mini is getting older now. It is a Core 2 Duo unit. So not sure what some of the newer models might fare like.

I would still look for a PC with an Express Card slot and just get a Firewire Controller card for it, with 6 pin ports. But that's just me and not wanting to over pay for a MacBook.

I have run several small events with my Echo Audiofire sound cards with SAC and running SAW for playback as well with the SAC-SAW link. Firewire can work just fine, when you get the right stuff and take the time to set it up right and you get lucky...

[sebastiandybing]

I am also looking for a new laptop,
and this Lenovo L520 http://shop.lenovo.com/us/laptops/th.../l-series/l520
has pcie port and seems to have a solid
construction.

Another Lenovo is the upcoming S430 with
3xusb3, thunderbolt, room for 2xHD, it has
no pcie port. But its possible to buy thunderbolt to
pcie port or a box with room for pcie cards.

Sebastian

[AlanH]

Thanks for the replies, chaps.

Some positive vibes from RBI and Bob on the Mac platform. At least you've confirmed that the FW port is available to Windows.

Richswit - sorry to hear of your joyless experience with your PC and FireWire. At least I got my Fujitsu notebook to see the interface, but it glitches from time to time, and occasionally just drops the FW altogether, requiring a full reboot. Had always attributed the behaviour to its low-powered Celeron processor.

Thanks for mentioning Lenovo, Sebastian - had wondered what happened to the IBM thinkpad! Will have a look at their models.

Will probably see if one of my friends has a MacBook with Bootcamp & XP and try out SAW/SAC on a thumbdrive with the MOTU FW interface. But if I can get good results with a PC notebook, I will.

Regards,

[mr_es335]

Hello,

I have used Firewire sucessfully with SS, using an 01x and an i88x (both Firewire interfaces). I wish I would have kept my i88x as it would have been a great interface for use with a laptop.

It is important to get a good Firewire card (Adaptec chipsets are the best). Stay away from the VIA chipsets - they are "horrible".

Also, there is a patch required for Windows XP that fixes the bugs that XP had with Firewire. If any are intersted, I can locate this patch and make it available to you.

Again, I used Firwire with Cubase SX for 8+ years and then ported to SS and never had any problems whatsoever.

[Teomi]

Windows XP will be unreliable with Firefire.
Windows 7 on bootcamp works perfectly!

I have a mac book pro and an 80 gig Winodws partition on Bootcamp and I use SS with my Fireface 800 without any problems.

The problems that xp has are with teh FW800 bus that Mac uses. But this problem is gone with Windows 7.

Eitan

[karagjoz]

The problems with firewire interface, are not between SS and the interface, but between Windows and the interface. On Macbook the same interface is working without any problems on OSx and with problems on Windows. So, the hardware is the same, but the OS...
Many interfaces - Presonus, Digi (now Avid), Motu, Mackie - are working very good with Mac and terrible with windows. I totally abandoned ProTools on Windows because of the problems with the audiocards, even wth their own Digi interfaces. On mac they work without problems.
On usb the situation mostly is the same. Only the PCI/PCI-E cards are reliable on windows in my opinion.

[RBIngraham]

Windows XP will be unreliable with Firefire.
Windows 7 on bootcamp works perfectly!

I have a mac book pro and an 80 gig Winodws partition on Bootcamp and I use SS with my Fireface 800 without any problems.

The problems that xp has are with the FW800 bus that Mac uses. But this problem is gone with Windows 7.

Eitan

Nonsense. I have run hundreds of shows with various software using Firewire interfaces under Win XP and SFX software.

It is all about getting a stable set up and the drivers for the interface you are dealing with.

If you had issues, I'm sorry to hear about that. I would never say it was bulletproof by any means. But if you're basing this statement off of one or a even a small handful of experiences, then I would say it's a rather flawed statement.

I have many, many systems using an Audiofire from Echo (various sizes, depending on the venue, show, etc..) running SFX under Win XP. They are very solid and reliable playback systems. I have used those same set ups with SAW and/or SAC... no problems at all.

Yes, firewire is tempermental to get bugs worked out sometimes. But it works just fine. I have had just as many issues with PCI or PCIe sound cards and USB2 interfaces as I have had with firewire.