Best Midi Controller ever for SAC ...to date!!

[Jeff Scott]

Hi Fu...what I'd like to see...which would, I think, work more in keeping with the way dedicated Hardware consoles is this....When I access a fader on ..let's say a Presonus or Yamaha LS9 digital board.....all of the EQ, Aux, and FX controls for THAT CHANNEL are instantly available on a set of dedicated Rotary knobs. If I select a different channel....all the FX and EQ controls for that channel are now available to be changed via the boards Rotary knobs. In other words...a dedicated set of Rotary knobs follows my Hot / Selected Channel.

What would eliminate a large part of the criticism and reluctance to use the SAC system, on the part of other Engineer's I've invited to look at SAC, is this....Having a BCF2000 hooked into SAC allowing me to have 8 chanels of Fader control, with Pan and Mutes on the top. (this is the way a lot of us currently use the BCF anyways...) But then I'd also like to have a BCR hooked into the SAC system as well. This would be linked to follow the Hot Channel. So whenever I select a channel...all of the EQ, Dynamics, FX Send and Aux controlls for that channel would be available on the BCR. This makes changing EQ's or Aux sends an very easy task. It's visual...you can see what you are doing easily, and fast.

The criticism that Phase Shifter offered for your setup is valid. I like that you have condensed so much into the BCF2000 unit. That's REALLY impressive. But it will require that the user remember a whole bunch of Shift/Alt/ Double press type moves. That will turn most people off as SAC already has a pile of those things. More things to remember = more things to forget during the middle of a Gig.

One of the positive advantages Hardware consoles have over SAC is that the better consoles minimize the need to go thru to lot's of different layers and special keystrokes or buttons presses. You will have some ..but the less you have the easier the system will be to operate and to learn. A criticism / Observation about SAC that many of us have experienced is that it is not as Intuitive / user friendly / Easy to learn as other digital consoles. Yes...SAC does so much more than most of them, and we SAC -heads love learning and using it. But the easier the SAC system is to approach...the more it will be accepted.

My thoughts on it for what it's worth.

[PhaseShifter]

SAC needs a decent controller with all of the details on the display of the controller. This should be the driving force behind a proper multi-touch tablet app for SAC.

[martiaudio]

"Will I AM" works on 3 massive multi touch screens to produce music on the stop in his second studio. So perhaps it has to be the future with no controller at all
despite manufacturers desperate attempt to provide bigger and bigger digital consoles..we will end up with encoders like an analog console hahaha.. What is the point in this. 2 steps ahead 3 steps back.haha.. that is manufacturers and conservative users ways.

For Now Fu has created a solution with our exciting equipment with the promise to get close to Digico and SmartAV tango luxurious controller feel. and he achieved just that remarkably.

My rig consist of 1xtouch screen 1x BCF2000 and trackball fixed in position with a custom Behrckie and I would not need anything else at all. at least for some years to come.
With careful Fn view design and a compact controller like mine all in one with digital snake. it is great.
So here we are Behrckie is "Idiot proof", super fast.. much faster than the current BCF2000/SAC solution.
Plus you have all the Hot channel strip control plus horizontal control on touch sensitive to navigate over 8 ch at the time and if fact all of the virtual console if you like. Actually it doesn't get better than that.
Last but not least you have the FOH/monitors and Fn Views on +- control on the BCF.. therefore you can have a Home button ( FOH+ F1 ) too, favourite of mine.
or a Cue reset.. nice one too.
and even more with ALT on BCF2000 to allow for a kind of DIY VCA with Rev. latching.

If you are intrigued and want to know more please watch all videos. ( There are some of mine with my equipment too to give some perspective to users ) and ask questions to Fu to know more about what is on offer before suggesting other things..

This kind of development takes a lot of time to make it work perfectly with no glitch.
And I say it again basically with the rig that most of us have. a
computer - i/o - SAC/SAW - BCF2000 a trackball (or mouse).. you've got nothing to loose. Only much more to gain and make SAC experience ultimate just for you.

I have a touch screen so I benefit of the Horizontal control on Screen directly. that is great it is on screen and BCF as well.

I find that several ways to achieve a control is more important to me than a too big controller with a lot of encoders.. as long as the short cuts or multifunctions are intuitives always and it is with Behrckie.
Congratulations Fu.

[operationwhat]

…..And the good news is… you probably already own it!! at least part of it!

Ok guys, no jokes at all I’m happy to come back here after a while to announce you that Behrckie Control is born! And already up and running!
Behrckie is a software that transforms your BCF2000 messages in Mackie Control Messages, and more…
Fu

Hi Fu...Great job!!!
I'm just curious, is it possible that we have 2 BFC and that one show track and the other returns ,busses and Mains?

[Jeff Scott]

OK Fu...I spent some time going thru your video's. I think you are on to something here. It's not as complex as I first thought....not as many Layers and Shift operations as it first appeared to have.

Question: How customizable is this? I don't just mean in terms of workflow n the way you've set up the BCF as per your video's. I'm thinking ore about the possibilities of integrating 2 or 3 BCF's in order to have a larger Fader count.....or integrating a BCR in order to increase the number of immediately available Rotary knobs.

Would your Server Programs allow for this type of flexibility or are you tied to the Single BCF format due to the Mackie Control Template?

Anyways...what you have created here gives a huge amount of control from a single BCF. Well done!

[Fulvio fullcode Politi]

Hi all,

And Hi Martial, nice to see you here, and to see that your system is growing

Jeff Scott
OK Fu...I spent some time going thru your video's. I think you are on to something here. It's not as complex as I first thought....not as many Layers and Shift operations as it first appeared to have.

aha right! actually the default layer only has direct access buttons, and some are sensible to double, triple press... and a single shift key. And most important if you got a touch screen the "shifted" functions are also presents on the touch screen, so they could be totally eliminate from the BCF layout... or changed in other functions useful for you, that you can think of as "your" custom layout.. like Martial did, whit his Aux 123, 456 ...it’s up to you!

Question: How customizable is this? I don't just mean in terms of workflow n the way you've set up the BCF as per your video's. I'm thinking ore about the possibilities of integrating 2 or 3 BCF's in order to have a larger Fader count.....or integrating a BCR in order to increase the number of immediately available Rotary knobs.

Would your Server Programs allow for this type of flexibility or are you tied to the Single BCF format due to the Mackie Control Template?

Again a BCF + BCR version IS already under development, or better ...that solution WAS the starting point of behrckie’s development!!

For what concern having more faders, without the use of a remote machine, the answer at the moment is NO, due to MackieProtocol limitations and how it is implemented in SAC at the moment. (.mct) but ...I'm quite sure, that it should be possible to obtain at least two working BCFs 2000, BUT this would require a little modifying of the MackieControl.mct ....by Bob? I'm for sure not able to do that!

PhaseShifter
Re: Best Midi Controller ever for SAC ...to date!!
SAC needs a decent controller with all of the details on the display of the controller. This should be the driving force behind a proper multi-touch tablet app for SAC.

hmmm I'm sorry to disagree here... I see an LCD strip for a SAC controller as something unuseful.... we got SAC interface it self for feedback, and I found it more complete and fast than every LCD... Same for mixing with tablets and not real fader (ok, perhaps it’s useful for some adjustment while fixing monitors around the hall at sound check) but normally ...no thanks. I prefer real fader…. even cheap faders!

What else to say, everybody has his vision, me and my beta testers, have found this path the more intriguing and cost effective at the moment.
Anyway thanks everybody for the interest.

cheers

Fu

[RandyHyde]

Wasn't there some rumor about the next version of SAC supporting more than one Mackie MCU or XT unit?

I realize that the controller cost is much higher, but that solution would make a much better "perfect controller" for SAC.

It will be interesting to see these Behringer solutions mated with the new Mackie templates when they arrive in SAC. Now let's just hope that the new templates arrive sometime soon.
Cheers,
Randy Hyde

[Fulvio fullcode Politi]

Hi Everybody,

Back with good news! :-)

Wasn't there some rumor about the next version of SAC supporting more than one Mackie MCU or XT unit?

I realize that the controller cost is much higher, but that solution would make a much better "perfect controller" for SAC.

It will be interesting to see these Behringer solutions mated with the new Mackie templates when they arrive in SAC. Now let's just hope that the new templates arrive sometime soon.
Cheers,
Randy Hyde

and Hi Randy, I didn't heard any rumor about a new mackie template for SAC supporting more than one Mackie unit... but sounds good!

So anyway I deeply tested behrckies solution, with a BCF+BCR hooked up to the same SAC copy, and found its working smooth, also I didn't notice any problem with the mackietemplate in SAC 3.1
I definitely think that there will be a Behrckie version for BCF+BCR
Here's a little video of it in action!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJgAs-53U5A

I will be back real soon, hopefully with some other good news!

Cheers,
Fu

[Jeff Scott]

Hi Fu....that looks great. Any Idea on a release date ?

[Fulvio fullcode Politi]

Hi Fu....that looks great. Any Idea on a release date ?

Hi Jeff!

I'm glad you like it! Release date is NOW more or less ...
From May 2nd I will start shipping Demo copy upon request, to anyone who wants to test the code before buy.
So you, and anyone else interested, feel free to drop me an email to obtain your test copy, possibly on the Facebook page, or on gmail at this address: behrckiecontrolsac@gmail.com

Cheers,

Fu