Recording a choir

[Gary Ray]

He has a girlfriend............

[Cary B. Cornett]

If all you need to do is capture a choir that performs well and sounds good in the room, the quick way to a good result is usually an ORTF or NOS cardioid pair, sometimes with wide-spaced omni "outriggers" to bring in the ends of you can't get the main pair far enough out front of the choir.

If you have to fight the choir to create the performance, you move in close with multiple mics. and for that, two mics per section is not unusual.

You mention problems with sibilance. Of you have a few "hissing snakes" hanging on past the proper cutoff, you can try selectively automating fades on the offending channels. However, this is easier to do in the pop-music "voice per track" scenario (overdubbed one at a time, where you don't have to fight leakage).

Oh, and NOS is the two mics angled 90 degrees apart and capsules separated by 30 cm (about a foot).

[Steve L]

Yes they are already recorded and what I have is it. I figured a way of automating the EQ's and it seems to work just fine. I don't want to completely get rid of the breath or "ssssss" sounds just decrease them to a normal level. The singers don't always hit their sounds at the same time so I leave the one that sounds correct. I've mixed 4 songs and let a friend who has a studio listen and he said I was on the right track. I am also automating the volume on passages to decrease all the bleed on the piano. I know this will get bad responses but I used a SM81 on the piano high end and a Shure PZM laying right on the piano on the low end. I didn't have a lot of time to experiment. Also gave the director a demo of SS Basic as he wanted to try to "mix it himself".
Steve L.
Mountain View Recording
Audio-Video Electronics
Richmond, KY

[Steve L]

yes .
Steve L.

[Bob L]

Sometimes I find that just zooming in on the waveform you can see the bad "ssss" exagerrated waveform data... in many cases I just mark across it and in Automation mode, just drop the fader 8 or 10db... this controls the "sss" annoyance factor without actually messing with the tone of the vocals... messing with the eq change to muffle out the "sss" is sometimes more noticable to my ear.

Bob L

[Cary B. Cornett]

I know this will get bad responses but I used a SM81 on the piano high end and a Shure PZM laying right on the piano on the low end.
Steve L.
Mountain View Recording
Audio-Video Electronics
Richmond, KY

The use of dissimilar mics for stereo capture of a decent grand piano can work surprisingly well. At a studio I worked at, SOP for recording their Baldwin SD-10 was an AKG 412 placed not quite midway along the bass strings, and a Neumann KM84 (both cardioid) over the high strings.

But for a live choir recording I don't do a stereo pickup of the piano, because I want it to sit "in the picture" of the main stereo pair. In fact, I almost never use the piano track in the mix because the piano holds its own against the choir without help from a spot mic. Of course, I'm talking traditional "classical" style choir recording here. If we're talking modern black gospel with a band, then you are looking for something a whole lot more like a record session, and in that case, yeah stereo pickup of the piano, assuming you aren't using a smapled instrument, where it's just direct anyway.

[Ian Alexander]

The use of dissimilar mics for stereo capture of a decent grand piano can work surprisingly well. At a studio I worked at, SOP for recording their Baldwin SD-10 was an AKG 412 placed not quite midway along the bass strings, and a Neumann KM84 (both cardioid) over the high strings.

But for a live choir recording I don't do a stereo pickup of the piano, because I want it to sit "in the picture" of the main stereo pair. In fact, I almost never use the piano track in the mix because the piano holds its own against the choir without help from a spot mic. Of course, I'm talking traditional "classical" style choir recording here. If we're talking modern black gospel with a band, then you are looking for something a whole lot more like a record session, and in that case, yeah stereo pickup of the piano, assuming you aren't using a smapled instrument, where it's just direct anyway.

I know you know this, but you can separate stereo piano tracks into two mono tracks and pan them to wherever you want the piano to be. You can have them panned slightly differently so it's a small stereo source or essentially make it mono at that spot on the stereo sound stage. Sometimes having two mics on the piano can give you more tonal control than EQ can achieve.

That said, in choral recordings I've done or assisted on, if there is any kind of accompaniment, we've often used a stereo pair for the whole stage and section mics on the choir, because sometimes instrumentalists are less than sensitive to the advantage they have over vocalists. And I played trombone and sang in school, so I've been the bully and the victim.

On the other hand, that reminds me of the time I was singing with a choir that joined an "early music" instrumental group for a concert. During the rehearsal, one of the violinists asked us to be sensitive to the fact that they were playing original instruments that aren't as loud as modern versions. I replied that we were using original instruments, too. It didn't go over well.

[Carl G.]

Sometimes I find that just zooming in on the waveform you can see the bad "ssss" exagerrated waveform data... in many cases I just mark across it and in Automation mode, just drop the fader 8 or 10db... this controls the "sss" annoyance factor without actually messing with the tone of the vocals... messing with the eq change to muffle out the "sss" is sometimes more noticable to my ear.

Bob L

Some use the De-esser route, but while quick and certainly effective, it can negatively affect other items within the freqency range of the "S". So, Bob's suggestion of automated audio level really does yield the cleanest most predictable results. Using the automation gallery - a simple highlight of the offending "S" and one click - it's fixed!