Laptop recording

[UpTilDawn]

Anybody here ever reliably record 32-40 simultaneous tracks on a laptop to either internal, or external hard drive using SAW and maybe with SAC as a front end?

I'm considering updating the lunchbox XP maybe in time for some outdoor Summer gigs, but I have no idea what may work these days. It'd be nice if I could continue to use the RME Digiface, but I have my doubts about how to interface with a laptop unless it has pcmcia. Any comments, ideas, whatever?

[RBIngraham]

The largest channel count I did with something like that, was in the 20s. Around 24 or so, going from memory.

It was a few years ago now and it was an XP laptop with Firewire using multiple Echo Audiofire units. And external USB hard drive for recording.

I was mixing live with SAC while recording.

[Dave Labrecque]

Anybody here ever reliably record 32-40 simultaneous tracks on a laptop to either internal, or external hard drive using SAW and maybe with SAC as a front end?

I'm considering updating the lunchbox XP maybe in time for some outdoor Summer gigs, but I have no idea what may work these days. It'd be nice if I could continue to use the RME Digiface, but I have my doubts about how to interface with a laptop unless it has pcmcia. Any comments, ideas, whatever?

I've done 24 tracks on my Digiface into a Pentium M laptop -- but to the internal hard drive. I guess that's not helping you much.

Even if you could use your Digiface, you'd max out at 24 tracks, so that's not a viable option, is it?

USB 2 and 3 should be plenty fast enough for 40 stereo tracks. With today's fast processors, I can't imagine you'd have a problem. But you do need an interface that can accommodate the number of tracks you want.

Hey -- you know more about this stuff than me. WTF?

RE: PCMCIA USB adaptors, how 'bout something like these? http://www.ebay.com/bhp/usb-pcmcia-c...der?rmvSB=true I have no idea if that'd work, of course.

[UpTilDawn]

I've done 24 tracks on my Digiface into a Pentium M laptop -- but to the internal hard drive. I guess that's not helping you much.

Even if you could use your Digiface, you'd max out at 24 tracks, so that's not a viable option, is it?

USB 2 and 3 should be plenty fast enough for 40 stereo tracks. With today's fast processors, I can't imagine you'd have a problem. But you do need an interface that can accommodate the number of tracks you want.

Hey -- you know more about this stuff than me. WTF?

RE: PCMCIA USB adaptors, how 'bout something like these? http://www.ebay.com/bhp/usb-pcmcia-c...der?rmvSB=true I have no idea if that'd work, of course.

Duh! I should have figured on there being a pcmcia to usb adapter floating around out there!

Frankly, I like the lunchbox/XP machine. But it is beginning to show its age and limitations - like the fact that it only has usb2 thanks to a pci card addition.
Fortunately, the internal hard drives handle the large track counts fine. It has 4-5 tiny fans and is rather noisy - too noisy for some situations. I never did like the built-in keyboard/trackpad and I've been using external keys, mouse and monitor ever since the built-in monitor gave out a couple years ago.

Seems to me that with a laptop it would be better to rely on external drives for multi-track recording than the internal one. I don't know that my current ThinkPad x60/XP could handle upwards of 40 tracks at once to the internal drive, but I haven't actually tried pushing it that far, because I don't know how to get 40 tracks into it. As you say, Dave, I max out at 24 tracks with the Digiface/pcmcia combo.

Fortunately, I don't require loads of plug-ins, or soft synths, etc. for this computer to do its job, so for a laptop to replace this lunchbox, I guess the two main things I need are
1- reliable hard drive speed for 40-track simultaneous work and
2- an interface that can get me to 40 tracks.

[UpTilDawn]

The largest channel count I did with something like that, was in the 20s. Around 24 or so, going from memory.

It was a few years ago now and it was an XP laptop with Firewire using multiple Echo Audiofire units. And external USB hard drive for recording.

I was mixing live with SAC while recording.

I've really liked using a ThinkPad with XP for some lower track count recordings. I pushed it to 24 tracks before, which worked really well - especially with SAC as a front end.

I recently changed the old hd for a larger capacity and 7,200rpm version. It recorded 24 tracks to the internal drive without breaking a sweat. But I haven't tried it to an external hard drive yet.

Have an opinion on whether or not it makes a difference as to what type of external setup you use - say, docking bay vs. a single drive aluminum enclosure?

I forgot that the thinkpad has a fw port....... Are there interfaces out there that can do more than 24 channels to a single laptop port? PCMCIA, or FW - either one should be able to work for me, right?... assuming there is something available. I'll have to do some research. It's been a while since I've looked for anything other than PCI.

Could I continue to use my 40 channels of Presonus preamps, with their ADAT/WC design? Or am I going to have to replace them as well?

[Cary B. Cornett]

Frankly, I like the lunchbox/XP machine. But it is beginning to show its age and limitations - like the fact that it only has usb2 thanks to a pci card addition.
Fortunately, the internal hard drives handle the large track counts fine. It has 4-5 tiny fans and is rather noisy - too noisy for some situations. I never did like the built-in keyboard/trackpad and I've been using external keys, mouse and monitor ever since the built-in monitor gave out a couple years ago.

I'm still using a uATX mobo XP build in a mini tower both in the studio and out in the field. I can carry the mini tower under my arm, but if was feeling really industrious I guess I could attach a handle to it. Right now I carry only 16 inputs using the MOTU 2048 interface with the internal 424 PCI card. So I'm hauling a 6-unit rack. I have a square suitcase that carries the display, fader pack, keyboard, trackball, computer cables, headphones and a note pad (the paper kind). Then there's the 125-foot snake in a flip-top box. And a layered plastic tote with microphones, cables and hardware. Did I mention the mic stands? And a little wheeled cart to bring it all in, 2 or 3 trips.

Using a laptop instead of the tower would make only a very small difference in the gig pack, I would have a smaller display, still need a trackball, and at least an add-on number pad. The only advantage to a laptop would be the built-in UPS in case of a power glitch, and those are rare in my experience. Oh, and with the MOTU interface I only have a single cable from computer to rack, if you don't count the power cord. And my setup has all analog input and output connections on the front panel.

I once intended to go laptop for the field, until I realized that it would only make a difference for really small recording setups, like if I was only putting up a simple stereo pair. You are carrying 40 inputs? Stick with a mini tower and use an internal PCI card interface. You'll save money and not be compromising your user interface to save weight.

[UpTilDawn]

I'm still using a uATX mobo XP build in a mini tower both in the studio and out in the field. I can carry the mini tower under my arm, but if was feeling really industrious I guess I could attach a handle to it. Right now I carry only 16 inputs using the MOTU 2048 interface with the internal 424 PCI card. So I'm hauling a 6-unit rack. I have a square suitcase that carries the display, fader pack, keyboard, trackball, computer cables, headphones and a note pad (the paper kind). Then there's the 125-foot snake in a flip-top box. And a layered plastic tote with microphones, cables and hardware. Did I mention the mic stands? And a little wheeled cart to bring it all in, 2 or 3 trips.

Using a laptop instead of the tower would make only a very small difference in the gig pack, I would have a smaller display, still need a trackball, and at least an add-on number pad. The only advantage to a laptop would be the built-in UPS in case of a power glitch, and those are rare in my experience. Oh, and with the MOTU interface I only have a single cable from computer to rack, if you don't count the power cord. And my setup has all analog input and output connections on the front panel.

I once intended to go laptop for the field, until I realized that it would only make a difference for really small recording setups, like if I was only putting up a simple stereo pair. You are carrying 40 inputs? Stick with a mini tower and use an internal PCI card interface. You'll save money and not be compromising your user interface to save weight.

I do know what you mean - and that's why I've continued to use the lunchbox. In fact, it's the second SAW system I ever got (with the first one, a tower for the studio).

Although I have enough of my own cables and mics (and stands, of course) for a 16-24 channel gig, I don't often need to provide my own stage gear - relying mostly on a sound company's stuff for that and providing my own splitter box and cables to connect to the recording gear. I'm grateful not to need to haul around a snake and cabling for 40 channels, when that's required. I'm happy NOT to be a soundman.

I do use a laptop for smaller setups and I guess I'd like to get the benefit of a smaller rig for the bigger jobs, but it'd really be sweeter still, if I could cut down the rack of preamps and other connecting gear to just one 6-space unit at the same time. I guess that's wishful thinking.

As you say, even if I can whittle the recorder and interface/preamps down to a couple of handfuls, there's still the mics, cables and stands. I'd love to get rid of all the copper and use either cat5e (6) or even wireless instead of a snake, but that's a whole lot of extra expense ...


For as stable as the lunchbox is, even after having to replace the built-in components for external KVM, the biggest issue I still have with it is the noise.
Anybody have any ideas on how to replace those tiny fans with one or two larger, quiet fans? I removed the monitor and keyboard recently to make the unit lighter... Can I mount both an intake and outtake fan in the case lid where the keyboard used to be, maybe? Would the airflow be messed up? Any suggestions there?

[Richard Rupert]

<SNIP>I forgot that the thinkpad has a fw port....... Are there interfaces out there that can do more than 24 channels to a single laptop port? PCMCIA, or FW - either one should be able to work for me, right?... assuming there is something available. I'll have to do some research. It's been a while since I've looked for anything other than PCI.

Could I continue to use my 40 channels of Presonus preamps, with their ADAT/WC design? Or am I going to have to replace them as well?

I believe the M-Audio Lightbridge would do what you want. I've been using one with SAC and a Lenovo T-60 very successfully, although I've recorded only about 12-14 tracks to an external USB drive while simultaneously running SAC. But it put very little strain on the computer doing so. Your preamps should interface perfectly.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/M-Audio-ProF...item4ae8a1a558

[UpTilDawn]

I believe the M-Audio Lightbridge would do what you want. I've been using one with SAC and a Lenovo T-60 very successfully, although I've recorded only about 12-14 tracks to an external USB drive while simultaneously running SAC. But it put very little strain on the computer doing so. Your preamps should interface perfectly.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/M-Audio-ProF...item4ae8a1a558

Thanks for the suggestion - got me looking into it in detail and looking around more for similar solutions.

This one falls short on inputs (since I've sometimes needed as many as 37 simultaneous inputs in the last few years) and as much as I've liked M-Audio stuff, I've also experienced consistently problematic FW drivers, which I couldn't risk at a live gig.

RME has products I've trusted from the start, but the price point goes waaaay up for me to get 30-40 channels into a laptop.

I've wanted to do something like this for awhile now - Maybe this is where I've stalled out in the past, when I get started thinking about going down this path...

[Ed Snape]

Regardless of which computer format, consider using an SSD as the internal boot drive. Based on the superb results of updating my 4 year old HP laptop, I have tried and obtained similar improvements by switching to SSDs on my wife's laptop and the studio desktop. I presume that the enhanced speed of an SSD in a laptop will enable your 40 track count with ease, if you can accomplish the inputs.