RMS value meter reference

[Richard Rupert]

Hi forumsters,

I have been requested to insure that all files I provide to an upload site are within a certain volume range. The request is worded thusly: "Each uploaded file must measure between -23dB and -18dB RMS". How does that translate to SAW's output meter? Or do I need to use a VST RMS meter?

TIA

[Grekim]

I use the Sonoris meter for RMS. The one in the SAW mixer is for peaks. You could also check loudness (offlline) in something equivalent to Wavelab. Or, if you have a reference track you could match it by ear, but maybe in your case you also need to know the actual numbers to be sure.

[Richard Rupert]

I use the Sonoris meter for RMS. The one in the SAW mixer is for peaks. You could also check loudness (offlline) in something equivalent to Wavelab. Or, if you have a reference track you could match it by ear, but maybe in your case you also need to know the actual numbers to be sure.

Thanks Grekim. I do believe I'll need to be more accurate than by simply using my ear though. So I guess the only solution is to use a plug-in then.

[ivanoff]

Thanks Grekim. I do believe I'll need to be more accurate than by simply using my ear though. So I guess the only solution is to use a plug-in then.

Here is a nice VU meter : http://klanghelm.com/VUMT.php

[Richard Rupert]

Here is a nice VU meter : http://klanghelm.com/VUMT.php

Thank you.

[Ian Alexander]

I use the Sonoris meter for RMS. The one in the SAW mixer is for peaks. You could also check loudness (offlline) in something equivalent to Wavelab. Or, if you have a reference track you could match it by ear, but maybe in your case you also need to know the actual numbers to be sure.

+1 for Sonoris Meter.

[Richard Rupert]

+1 for Sonoris Meter.

Pros in TV land use Waves WLM plus. Nugen's Mastercheck is a great second.

Thank you guys... I've got a good handle on this now and appreciate all the replies.

[Dave Labrecque]

What's typically meant by such a spec? The "average" RMS reading over the entire program? Or the highest "peak" RMS reading over the entire program?

[Dave Labrecque]

Usually a client or network will give you a range. VOs must all be in, let's say, a -24 to -18 range. Overall range must be -24.
Discovery, for instance, has strict guidelines for where the music, backgrounds, and VOs should sit in the mix. The range levels are suggested for all elements. It seems tough, but just check out an episode of Deadliest Catch. Even with all of the screaming, sea noise, etc. the voices are legible, the music is loud, the sounds are full.
Just using a 1khz tone VU meter won't do anymore for TV deliverables.

Sorry to be so difficult, but I still don't know what they're asking for. What does "in a certain range" mean? Max RMS in that range? Cuz the minimum will surely drop to or close to -40 or something at some points. If they're talking an average, they would need to specify a time interval.

This is a quantitative spec, no? Otherwise, it's qualitative and up to individual judgement as to what it means. Or so it seems to me.

[Richard Rupert]

Dave,

It's not that complex. Let's just take the narration. When we use a limiter, we can cut off the top level to stop at -18. On the low level side, you can use clip gain or raise the level so that the quiet part of the narration doesn't go below -24.
Whatever levels they give you, you keep in that range. No higher than -18 and no lower that -24. [or whatever level they give you]
Some TV networks prefer to keep the highest level at -24 for the ATSC 85 standard. And the lowest they want the narration is -28 or -29. If the overall narration level reads -24, everything's fine. The Waves WLM meter and the Nugen Mastercheck meter help you keep the tracks in tolerance. Download a manual and/or watch some of the videos on their sites to get a better grasp on this deal.
If you're doing audio for TV or Film, these meters are necessary. They both have various settings for many Video and audio standards. I've done better mixes because of the WLM on my final mix.
It's a mechanical way to take the guess work out of level management. No individual judgement needed.

My initial question came from a requirement for submission of narration-only audio; specifically books on audio. My wife is a V/O artist and has been requested to read some books for Amazon. I hope they're technical manuals or I could get pretty bored listening. Stashu's explanation is very good.