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  1. #1

    Default Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Greetings, so very helpful SAW World folks. This forum is the best. I ALWAYS find the answer here.
    The issue: Working on a feature film sound design project. I've been doing some pans on FX tracks and the pans are showing up in the mix exactly OPPOSITE of the panning assignments after rendering a mix file.
    At first I thought it was simply my monitors out of L/R orientation, but that proved wrong after burning a mix file. So now when I orient my monitors correctly they are projecting the stereo image exactly opposite of my pan assignments.
    This has me a little stumped. For instance a full pan left is not only showing up on correctly oriented monitors as full right, but the rendered mix is also reflected in an opposite stereo image.
    What's the dang deal? Hopefully I'm just being simple stupid somewhere.
    BTW this is a newish computer with a full wipe and fresh install of Win 10 Pro with recommended fixes and fresh updated install of SAW Studio. Using iZotope RX 67 advanced as an offline (awesome fixer for dialog)
    Teddy Hallaron
    FJH Studios
    Houston, TX

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Portland, Maine U.S.A.
    Posts
    2,187

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    SAW’s pans work correctly, so there must be an error either in Saw’s channel assignment page for the sound card, in the sound card’s applet, or in your wiring.
    Michael McInnis Productions

  3. #3

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Yes, Michael, agreed about the sound card issue. I know its not the wiring of the monitors, I've checked that out extensively and the clincher is the rendered files showing up "backwards". Unfortunately I don't know how to proceed when going "deep" regarding the card. My quick workaround would be just to pan everything opposite in SAW and wire my monitors backwards again. Since this is a new computer and I'm just using the internal sound card for monitoring, I'm stuck with that for now. I may be adding a new PCI sound card which includes a 5.1 pigtail this week, maybe that will solve the issue.
    Thanks for the feedback.
    Teddy Hallaron
    FJH Studios
    Houston, TX

  4. #4

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Quote Originally Posted by Teddy Hallaron View Post
    Yes, Michael, agreed about the sound card issue. I know its not the wiring of the monitors, I've checked that out extensively and the clincher is the rendered files showing up "backwards". Unfortunately I don't know how to proceed when going "deep" regarding the card. My quick workaround would be just to pan everything opposite in SAW and wire my monitors backwards again. Since this is a new computer and I'm just using the internal sound card for monitoring, I'm stuck with that for now. I may be adding a new PCI sound card which includes a 5.1 pigtail this week, maybe that will solve the issue.
    Thanks for the feedback.
    A couple thoughts:

    1) any chance you have a reverse-stereo (swap L and R) button pushed somewhere? I think the "native" Brainspawn panner has that in there.

    2) you could swap L and R at the end of the stereo mix bus(es). I guess you already thought of that.
    Dave "it aint the heat, it's the humidity" Labrecque
    Becket, Massachusetts

  5. #5

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Perhaps you have a swap LR plugin patched on the outputs... check this... place a soundfile on track 1... pan left... is the chan 1 meter reading correctly... good... now look at the out track... is that meter reading correctly... if not... somewhere there is a pplugin patch that is swapping channels... if the meters read correctly, then the buildmix will be exactly the same... now if all that is correct and you are hearing the signal incorrectly in your monitors... they are wired backwards physically.... or the physical soundcard is swapping channels somewhere in the driver applet.

    Bob L

  6. #6

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Thanks guys, I always forget just how many ways in SAW there are to fix things. I'll double check to see if I did something funky by mistake. I did do some automated reverse phase on a boom track that I let live with a lav track. I like to put about a 20% boom in there to create some "air" but its usually safer to reverse the phase to avoid Phase holes and anomalies between the mics. I love that I can automate this function.

    And @Dave, I actually didn't think of swapping L/R at the end of the chain, brilliant.

    Good to hear from you guys, appreciate it.
    Teddy Hallaron
    FJH Studios
    Houston, TX

  7. #7

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Ok, it's all good. SAW was acting perfect - of course, and I have awarded myself the "Idiot of the Day" award. It was complicated, but embarrassing.
    Rechecked it on my TV soundbar system after burning a small 100% panned left section burned to a jump drive - perfect. The problem was with my office workstation, looks like my monitor stereo orientation was wired backwards.

    "Don't assume the worst. Its usually the simple things." - - Me

    Sorry about all the drama. I couldn't find a "Doofus" emoji
    Teddy Hallaron
    FJH Studios
    Houston, TX

  8. #8

    Default Re: Out of the Frying "PAN"

    Quote Originally Posted by Teddy Hallaron View Post
    Ok, it's all good. SAW was acting perfect - of course, and I have awarded myself the "Idiot of the Day" award. It was complicated, but embarrassing.
    Rechecked it on my TV soundbar system after burning a small 100% panned left section burned to a jump drive - perfect. The problem was with my office workstation, looks like my monitor stereo orientation was wired backwards.

    "Don't assume the worst. Its usually the simple things." - - Me

    Sorry about all the drama. I couldn't find a "Doofus" emoji
    If it makes you feel any better, I just hooked up my old Mackie HR824 monitors after several months of non-use. First, one had really low volume (one of the switches on the back had a dirty internal contact that needed a quick on-off motion). Then the other one quit altogether. I thought it had simply, finally given up the ghost -- until I realized that in my L/R cable swap troubleshooting, I'd plugged one of the monitor output signal lines into the wrong jack on my MBox (an input, I think). It is indeed the simple things.

    Glad you got it sussed.
    Dave "it aint the heat, it's the humidity" Labrecque
    Becket, Massachusetts

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