In Ear Monitor Limiter?

[John F]

I'm running sound tomorrow for my church band, which will be performing a 90-minute set for our local college students. We've had two rehearsals so far with my new SAC system, and so far things have gone pretty well - most musicians are very happy with the mix they've been able to get in their IEMs. And of course, the system sounds great in FOH. Our band leader, who has very sensitive ears though, has been complaining that it's either too loud or too soft, and he can't seem to find a good middle ground. I'm using a virtual monitor mixer to feed everyone's IEMs with a little compression on each input. I'm wondering if I should create two subgroups - one for instruments and one for vocals, and put a pretty high-ratio compresssor on those two channels to act as limiters? Is that normal practice?

Thanks for any advice you may be able to offer!

John Francis
Rolla, MO

[Carl G.]

I'm running sound tomorrow for my church band, which will be performing a 90-minute set for our local college students. We've had two rehearsals so far with my new SAC system, and so far things have gone pretty well - most musicians are very happy with the mix they've been able to get in their IEMs. And of course, the system sounds great in FOH. Our band leader, who has very sensitive ears though, has been complaining that it's either too loud or too soft, and he can't seem to find a good middle ground. I'm using a virtual monitor mixer to feed everyone's IEMs with a little compression on each input. I'm wondering if I should create two subgroups - one for instruments and one for vocals, and put a pretty high-ratio compresssor on those two channels to act as limiters? Is that normal practice?

Thanks for any advice you may be able to offer!

John Francis
Rolla, MO

John, for IEM's (personally) I would always use limiting (high ratio compressor) for just the audio 'Peaks' on final monitor output to protect the ears of those listening (ear protection from adverse events). Your idea of having instruments in a subgroup and vocals in another is a great idea simplifying the mix (often used in live situations), but compressing each (with low thresholds) is NOT the best solution.

A better solution (since your band leader is complaining about 'too soft') is to parallel feed (post fader) all the instruments to one AUX, and all the vocal to another Aux... Then super heavily compress those Aux channels (with a plugin of your choice, using a Low threshold reaching down to the softer sounds, with Fast attack). Then subtly blend that highly compressed Aux back into their respective sub groups (Instrument Aux back to Instrument Subgroup and Vocal Aux back to Vocal Subgroup). Depending on music material... the Aux blend-in should never be more than source, and often 5 to 15 db (or less) below source material.... totally up to you. The nice thing about doing it this way (instead of a compressor with a "mix" control between source and plugin output), is that you can also add other tools in the aux (like EQ prior to compression for subtle clarity, etc.). The final effect on output master mix is a much fuller sound, greater body, and more 'Emotional Feel' to the mix. And, of course, you get better dynamic control WITHOUT the artifacts of compression. Try it! You'll like it!

[cgrafx]

couple of questions

1. what method of amplification are you using to drive the IEM/headphones. Are there headphone amps or wireless packs or is it a mixture?

2. what do you mean by your using a virtual mixer? Are you talking about SAC monitor mixes or something else?

[John F]

couple of questions

1. what method of amplification are you using to drive the IEM/headphones. Are there headphone amps or wireless packs or is it a mixture?

2. what do you mean by your using a virtual mixer? Are you talking about SAC monitor mixes or something else?

1. We're using wireless IEM transmitters
2. I set up Monitor 1 as the engineers monitor, and all the other monitors feed off of it, post-fader.

[John F]

John, for IEM's (personally) I would always use limiting (high ratio compressor) for just the audio 'Peaks' on final monitor output to protect the ears of those listening (ear protection from adverse events). Your idea of having instruments in a subgroup and vocals in another is a great idea simplifying the mix (often used in live situations), but compressing each (with low thresholds) is NOT the best solution.

A better solution (since your band leader is complaining about 'too soft') is to parallel feed (post fader) all the instruments to one AUX, and all the vocal to another Aux... Then super heavily compress those Aux channels (with a plugin of your choice, using a Low threshold reaching down to the softer sounds, with Fast attack). Then subtly blend that highly compressed Aux back into their respective sub groups (Instrument Aux back to Instrument Subgroup and Vocal Aux back to Vocal Subgroup). Depending on music material... the Aux blend-in should never be more than source, and often 5 to 15 db (or less) below source material.... totally up to you. The nice thing about doing it this way (instead of a compressor with a "mix" control between source and plugin output), is that you can also add other tools in the aux (like EQ prior to compression for subtle clarity, etc.). The final effect on output master mix is a much fuller sound, greater body, and more 'Emotional Feel' to the mix. And, of course, you get better dynamic control WITHOUT the artifacts of compression. Try it! You'll like it!

This is a really interesting approach Carl! Just to clarify - is mixing the highly compressed audio on the aux channels intended just for the IEM mix?

[cgrafx]

1. We're using wireless IEM transmitters
2. I set up Monitor 1 as the engineers monitor, and all the other monitors feed off of it, post-fader.

Hi John,

1. What IEM system/transmitters/receivers are you using?
2. If you are using something like a Shure PSM system, depending on the model there are limiters built in to the receiver packs. If so, those are brick wall limiters and need to be set properly.

Your Question: This is a really interesting approach Carl! Just to clarify - is mixing the highly compressed audio on the aux channels intended just for the IEM mix?

I'll answer for Carl. Yes this is just for the IEM mix. Remember that in the default SAC setup every monitor mix is its own separate mixer with separate AUX sends.

You can also use this parallel compression technique on the FOH, but it will have different feedback implications when your dealing with open mics and live speakers vs IEMs that don't contribute back to the sound being picked up by the mics.

As Carl also suggested its very important to have some form of limiter on the IEM as a safety, but as I already mentioned depending on your IEM wireless packs, you may already have that built-in.

[Carl G.]

This is a really interesting approach Carl! Just to clarify - is mixing the highly compressed audio on the aux channels intended just for the IEM mix?

IEM (IF the IEM's don't have it built in), and also (carefully) as desired for house mix (but very careful about that.... See Phillip's Great response).

Of course, if you were recording for later mixing, you would use another output channel sans the Aux channels (or simply from another mixer), so you could do what you ever you wanted to do in Post Production.