Happy Thanksgiving!

[UpTilDawn]

Amen to that.

DanT

I give thanks for this universe in all its splendor and this little marble bowling ball of a playground we get to play on.

[Cary B. Cornett]

Of course, I agree that 1 in 6 is better than 6 in 6. But I feel you were taking the opportunity of a (welcome) history lesson to also make a political point, (albeit one that most Americans would likely agree with) so I thought I'd be a little contrary, or at least point out the failings of the full-blown embracing of Free Enterprise. Find me a city in Sweden where 1 in 6 are starving.

Never said Capitalism did not have its difficulties (Man has yet to devise a system that does NOT have its problems). However, you cannot have true Freedom without the possibility of individual Failure.

I would also say that, if every individual human being would decide, of their own free will, to always act in a virtuous manner, then NO ONE would starve. I believe that Charity is terribly important, but also that if it is not a Choice then it is not truly Charity. If every man will be charitable because he wants to be, there is no need for Government to step in to help the less fortunate. If Government is expected to step in, then those who think so believe they are justified in partially enslaving those who would not, on their own, choose to be charitable.

Oh, and let us not forget that, of all nations and peoples, statistically Americans are actually the most giving people (of freewill donations) on earth. So, whatever its faults, Free Enterprise also appears to encourage individual charity.

That said, while I do not accept Socialism as a viable or virtuous way of handling the world's problems, I also am not a doctrinaire Laissez-Faire Capitalist. I believe that carefully crafted laws and regulations are needed to curb abuses of economic power. To be clearer, being Rich is OK, even good, but using Wealth to rob or enslave others is Evil. I do not care how much money any man has or gets, so long as he does not use it to abuse others.

In the spirit of this thread, an important part of what I am thankful for at this season is that I am allowed to choose to do that which is good and right, and that I am allowed to decide for myself what actions of my own would best demonstrate that desire.

[lofi studios]

Oh, and let us not forget that, of all nations and peoples, statistically Americans are actually the most giving people (of freewill donations) on earth. So, whatever its faults, Free Enterprise also appears to encourage individual charity.

i have kept out of this as its not fitting the reason behind the initial post, but where did you get those 'statistics' from? and to whome were the donations meant?

not being inflamatory, so please dont take it like that, just very interested as to what criteria was used as a measuring stick in those eqations...

Iain

[CurtZHP]

90% of statistics are made up.

[Cary B. Cornett]

i have kept out of this as its not fitting the reason behind the initial post, but where did you get those 'statistics' from? and to whome were the donations meant?

not being inflamatory, so please dont take it like that, just very interested as to what criteria was used as a measuring stick in those eqations...

This was something that over time I heard from more than one mass media source, something among the more prominent "usual suspect" news organizations, but unfortunately I cannot recall which, nor the exact date. As these were broadcast sources, it is unlikely that, even if I could name it exactly, it would be readily searchable.

Just for fun, though, a quick search yielded this
and this
with some interesting discussion here
Adding target terms "individual giving" and "private donations" yields this list from MSNBC. Please note that THIS list is weighted according to percentage of GDP, and that MSNBC is not known for blind "boosterism" where the US is concened (if anything, they lean the other way!).
and an interesting take on private giving here.
and finally, here is an article about the importance of private giving in the US.

It was interesting, in looking at various items, to see how various groups "massaged" the numbers to favor specific conclusions, such as looking primarily at governmental foreign aid and trying to ignore the value of private donations. I found it really interesting, though, that one article emphasized remittances from immigrants (legal or not) to families back home as an often ignored, yet very large, portion of "foreign aid".

My personal point, of course, was about the fact that there is a tendency for citizens of "free market" oriented nations to be more generous as individuals than their counterparts in countries with much larger "social safety nets". Based on what I was able to find just now, then, my original conclusion still stands.

[John Hernandez]

You couldn't possibly be taking about America under the Bush administration.

Mark

No. He's talking about the future administration...under HUCK!


John

[Pedro Itriago]

50% of all stats have some truth in them

[John Hernandez]

50% of all stats have some truth in them

Yes, but is that statement in the 50%?

John

[Pedro Itriago]

Yes, but is that statement in the 50%?

John

Chances are, it is.

[Tim Miskimon]

It's that time again - we need a new SAW update to keep the forum from sinking into worthless political debates...